Spencer Hilligoss – 3200 Doors and Still working a Day Job

Ep #363 – Spencer Hilligoss – 3200 Doors and Still working a Day Job

Here is some of what you will learn:

Working with a spouse
Go slow to go fast
Ruthlessly Prioritize
The importance of clarity
Understanding Purpose Alignment
The Introvert’s Approach
Importance of converting learning into action
Considering worst case scenarios
Phasing out your day job
Getting paid to learn

To find out more about our guest: click here 

Full Transcript Below:

Ep #363 – Spencer Hilligoss – 3,200 Doors and Still working a Day Job

Hi! I’m Rod Khleif. Each and every week I record an interview with a thought leader that I know you’re gonna get a ton of value from. Now here on YouTube are the video versions of my podcast, Lifetime Cash Flow through Real Estate Investing. Now to make sure you get the latest information please subscribe and hit the notification bell. Let’s get started.

Rod: Welcome to another edition of how to build a Lifetime Cash Flow through Real Estate Investing. I’m Rod Kleif and I am thrilled that you’re here, and you’re gonna get tremendous benefit and value from the dynamic guy that we’re interviewing today. He’s named Spencer Hilligoss and Spencer is in over 3200 doors and as a full-time job still, and so we are going to dig into how he has done that and see if we can mitigate any excuses you may have about getting there. Welcome to the show brother.

Spencer: It’s really an honor to be here Rod and I’m listening to your podcast for the last few years, and the many that I’ve tried to listen to I gotta say that you bring an inspiration to me and you bring an inspiration to many others. So, thank you for everything you do. looking, you know, …

Rod: What a kind thing. Thank you, thank you my friend. Thank you for saying that. So, you know, like we do then you know the one of the first things we do is I asked my guest just to kind of give a little bit of a background on their story and, you know, so let’s start there. Let’s how’d you get. How’d you get into this business. How’d you get started. How’d you get through over 3200 doors with a full-time job. So, let’s go.

Spencer: Yeah, I mean, that sounds crazy when you ask about, ask it out loud I didn’t need for me to hear that. So, I’m 13 years into a career in Silicon Valley. High-tech companies, you know, that has been what I’ve done. And so, five different software companies. Somehow I got talked into going over to a real estate tech company about four years ago by my mentor. And I joined, and suddenly I’m surrounded with people that are all flippers, primarily. You know, these are single family home flippers entrepreneurs. I have been building sales and operations teams for thirteen years and at this company I suddenly find myself getting licensed as a loan originator. I find myself training people, hiring people, and doing what I do but through the lens of real estate and I was sitting there going, well, I certainly don’t want to become a flipper, that’s just not aligned with my strategy but I do wanna do some actively and I know I’ve been building up what I’d like to think is good, startup equity, when you’re working these tech companies’ early stage, there’re a lot of selling that goes into people joining those with the notion of saying; you’re eventually gonna join the next Google or Facebook …

Rod: Right.

Spencer: … unfortunately most people look based on the numbers, you know, you can play the odds but that is not real, you know, equity value until those things that can materialize.

Rod: Right.

Spencer: So, I joined this this tech company, this real estate teach company, and I’m just, I get the bug. I get the bug bad and I start going off and building that residential real estate portfolio.

Rod: You started with houses?

Spencer: I did. And we still actually have a very modest residential portfolio so we actually have about seven properties we own out right. Started reading voraciously about multi-family. All the numbers made sense, and now we focus on multi-family self-storage and mobile home parks but that was really the journey is, you know, hundreds of podcasts and many of which were yours, you know, devouring the books and squeezing out the time in between meetings, and nights put our two young boys down, you know, at the end of a long workday and eventually getting to the point where my business partner and wife, and we could talk about that later how we figured that one out. That has led to where we are now, and it’s still I wake up every day it kind of in odd the fact that we’re on this wild ride it’s not always easy, but it’s absolutely worth it.

Rod: Right. So are still doing, you’re still at a real estate tech company doing loan origination or managing teams that do that, and doing this on the side. So, let’s go right there because people are gonna be like 3000, 3200 doors as, mostly as a General Partner as well, I mean, it’s easy for somebody to, you know, go in and being a limited partner on a deal and just and just put equity in on a deal but you’re on the GP side on, I think eighty percent of those deals you said, so, you know, that involves a lot of work. So, as it relates to you and your bride, how do you divide and conquer? Do you do you have complementing skill sets? Do you kinda both do the same things? Can we can we get a little micro on that piece first?

Spencer: Oh you better believe it. I’d like to say, we have some perfect framework and I’d say it’s evolving, but there are complementary strengths for sure. I have done most of my work in my corporate career, on business development, sales operations, sales operational building. So, I know that side and I’ve gone, I’ve hired hundreds of people, I’ve trained hundreds of people including leadership all the way down to individual contributors. So that’s what I bring management as well as leadership and scaling it is there. My wife is the marketing brain and she knows that side, she’s a brand manager, she’s still managing her corporate career. So, she is super smart when it comes to thinking about a strategy and how to think long game, and she’ll look at an operational plan, break it down into its component parts. She’s also great with the numbers. She knows how to read a P&L, Profit and Loss statement, for a business like that. And so, I’m so deeply thankful that she can check me when I get overly excited. I would say that there’s typically in a couple, one more risk adverse and one more risky. And I would say that we’re a good complement there. I am typically the one who’s a little bit more risk-taking. She is the one who hits the brakes on me when I get it get very excited about an idea. So, I think …

Rod: Is she more analytical than you?

Spencer: You know, that’s actually funny. I would say I’m reluctantly analytical so I do end up going deep on a spreadsheet. I would say we actually both are analytical.

Rod: Okay.

Spencer: That’s one area of strong overlap.

Rod: Okay. Cuz sometimes, you know, I’ve seen some matches made in heaven where you pair up an outgoing personality with an introverted analytical person and, I mean, it just it’s a rocket ship. So, but, do you both have both skillsets very interesting. So, let’s go back to the first multifamily deal that you are a GP. Can you speak to how that came about? Maybe go a little micro on that. Do you …

Spencer: Yeah.

Rod: I’m assuming you’re not buying in Silicon Valley or you’re out of state. Is there, are you in more than one market? What was the first market?

Spencer: Yeah. Man, that is such a scary first moment but when looking back on it now you’re like wow that was actually not that bad. So that was actually in DFW in Dallas Texas. And at that time, I had gone through three different real estate coaching programs, and so I had signed up, I believe in coaching little harder than willing to pay for it to.

Rod: Right.

Spencer: And so, I had gone through two programs and I felt like I had learned at that point under writing. I had under written lots of deals. Second one was basically market analysis. So, like looking at the deal, looking at the market and I just want to call out this pre work beforehand because I think it’s not like a stumble. I didn’t do it. It was a pretty deliberate thing but those two pieces were critical. The third coaching program was when I actually hooked up with a coach who would also let me drive along with him on a deal.

Rod: Nice.

Spencer; That was great. Yeah, that was, I’d recommend the same for anyone else, you know, if you can find a person that’s willing to let you ride along and then do the work in the service of learning. That’s where it that.

Rod: Did you utilize this person as a sponsor on your first deal? Or, you know, tell me, you know, let’s break it down even further because so many people, obviously, start with a sponsor that’s signed on Fannie Mae debt before for example. If you’re going Fannie Mae or just bring the, you know, the resume, the balance sheet or the experience component to a deal. Is that how you did your first one? Or how’d you make it happen?

Spencer: Yeah. The first one, I was just playing to strength and I was gonna do, what I mean by that is I have a deep network out here in Silicon Valley, of people that I’ve been working with for the past decade, and so they looked at me and they’re like, what value can you add, and I say, “I’m highly organized. I can do a spreadsheet.I can also manage a communication infrastructure.” So I’m really good at making sure people are informed with reporting, people know what they’re actually getting into in the deal. You know, throughout the life of the deal to get really great updates and so what we can actually do is let me take investor relations, and then I’m able to bring in the equity capital. I’m so, that was the compliment that I could bring and it’s also realistic because diving in to do everything from asset management all the way over to acquisition, and everything in between, that’s a lot of chunks to bite off when you’re doing your first one, and so, what I felt is like it actually complement-investor relations you off all that and be able to bring the equity capital. So that was really the focus of that first one.

Rod: Okay. Okay. Now, are you playing an active role on the GP side in either asset management, due diligence, all those pieces as well?

Spencer: On the due diligence, yes. On asset management, no. Not yet. I’m deliberately trying to kinda hold off on that part because there will come a time I would like to think in the next roughly 12 to 18 months where I will pull the cord, pull the ripcord, and just go full-time active because this is such a passion for me. So, at that point I would like to get more into the outside net inside but for right now due diligence a lot of underwriting and then also, of course, just investor relations at that.

Rod: Okay.

Spencer: So the front end of the core, front end in terms of the underwrite operational review and investor relations throughout the life of the projects, project readouts. All that good stuff.

Rod: Okay, okay. So, tell me, how do you manage all this shift? Two small boys did you say that?

Spencer: I do. Yeah, two and five.

Rod: Two and five. Holy cow

Spencer: Right in there.

Rod: Wow, and you guys both have full-time W2 jobs?

Spencer: We do. I don’t know why we do all this.

Rod: And you have 3,200 freakin doors. So give us some, give my listeners some strategies for managing that kind of a load. I mean, that’s just incredible.

Spencer: Yeah. So yeah. This isn’t for everybody but this has been working for us. What we do, is we take our big goals, we actually take the time to do that first and foremost and that means my wife worked in business partner Jennifer Morimoto and I. We carve out the time. Gotta be awakened usually when the kids, literally, when the kids are napping and we sit there and we block strategy time. We’ve said what are the big goals? We start we talk about those goals. We don’t move off that topic, it might take a weekend or two just to get down to clarity on what is our plan, like what are we going for here. We then take those goals, break them down into smaller time increments, you go every six months, you go quarterly, you should rink it down further, you say, monthly, you then say, weekly, you get the idea? You go all the way down to that weekly like level and then we say, what are the top three things, if everything else fails that must occur this week. Right like what are the feet with what has to get done this week. Sometimes that list is like one thing, and if that thing is like a project or it’s a relationship that we need to make sure that lands well, that, what I’m gonna give everything I have to, and I’m gonna go into my calendar, I’m gonna gut the whole week. I’m gonna look at my meetings and move everything I can move, including stuff that has other people going to it and just let them know, if I have to break it to them, like, I’m sorry, I move this meeting out. I really have to get this other thing done. And I think that’s the point Rob, where I used to get gun-shy, and I think a lot of people do because it’s socially awkward. You gotta go over to other people and say, hey, you know, I’m sorry brother. I gotta back out of this meeting or I gotta move into next week, and they’ll say for a moment; ah, well that’s a shame I wanted to talk to you but yeah we can meet next week. That’s the moment of awkwardness where people get held up from actually going and being ruthlessly prioritizing and moving forward on the big goals and so there’s that, I would like to make it sound like; it’s a perfect system, it’s not, I mean, there was a day, about a month ago, where we were sitting there and we were just wiped, you know, we were sitting there going like we have been scheduling, if you look at our family calendar we both use Google Calendar, and we stacked that thing down to the minute, every day. And it’s that, that might sound stressful. It’s, that’s like freedom to me. I think of that as clarity. I also think of that as when I say schedule I don’t mean meetings the whole time. People will look at their calendar and think wow I have all this great time. I can get all this work done, but what they don’t do is they don’t say I need two hours to go underwrite that deal, and I’m gonna go block it on my calendar on Thursday from 9 to 11 a.m. That’s that steps, that evades most people, and I strongly encourage people to try that out and see if it’s a fit for them because that was a game-changer for me.

Rod: Yeah, I know. It’s actually, I teach a weekly planning process and it’s really resonating what you’re saying with me because the last step is to block time. You know, it’s like, the step before that is to identify like you just did ruthlessly prioritize the Pareto principle whatever, you know, on every list there’s twenty, ten to twenty percent to get you 80% further to identify those things and then block time for them. So we’re very aligned on that and, you know, you’re proof positive that it works, so I’m gonna use you as an example that process works. I love that term ruthlessly prioritizing, and guys, the other thing that I want you to take away from what Spence just said is, is clarity. You’ve gotta have clarity. So you said, you might take two full weekends to define exactly what it is you want. You have to know exactly what you want other words out how the hell are you ever gonna get it. Clarity is power. You gotta have clarity. I love that, and I love the fact that you’re hammering home the need to time block. I’m actually interview, I’ve got the student that I interview live that I’m coaching, she was used somebody that I did a contest and she’s single mom with four kids and she won the contest.

Spencer: Wow.

Rod: When she told me she babysat kids at home too to have enough money that was, that’s my mom’s story, and there was a boom, okay, it’s you. You’re the other one. So anyway, I’m interviewing her tonight and that’s one of the things that we’re gonna talk about because she’s got four kids once one-year-old. She has got to master this time blocking piece, and so we’re gonna actually discuss it tonight which is why that triggered that memory. So let’s talk about …

Spencer: Whoo!

Rod: Yeah, yeah. Awesome, awesome lady. Real excited to help her see a success and when that happens, I, there are no one is ever gonna give me an excuse again, okay? Because that’s the reason I selected her, but. So, what are, you know, you told me what your superpowers are and your wife’s superpowers and you complement each other, you know. Talk to me about if you’re coaching someone to get into this business, what are some of the qualities you’d look for in that person? What does it take to do this?

Spencer: You know, I’m an introvert by default. I don’t know how the hell I got into a sales leadership career. That is a weird one even today. By default, I don’t just wake up in the morning and want to go out and be social. I think that is point number one because I didn’t used to understand what it meant to be in a relationship business. So, can people learn to really cherish the relationship with other people? Absolutely, absolutely. I mean, every person has that capacity, and so I bring that up first and foremost because it’s been such a big deal to me and, like, you can wake up need that coffee to get excited for the day maybe. I’d be certainly buy coffee, but I would say I get excited to come and talk to you. I get excited to go and talk to my team. I get excited to go and learn about someone’s background.

Rod: Do you have to force that? Do you have to force that? Do you have to pre frame that in your, do you have to, like, shift that in your head consciously? Or is it now natural? That excitement.

Spencer: Most days. When the purpose is clear example would be, for Madison investing for my business. I would say, I wake up in the morning and I go, I am fired up to talk to anyone about this. Like it is just, it is so much fun and challenging and engaging. I, it takes no coffee at all, and that comes down to me for purpose alignment. That is, you know, we have found something that we can not only contribute to, but it will ultimately be able to give back to others throughout the impact we’re trying to make. That is all the coffee that I need. Now, if it’s something that is for, let’s say, I, you know, I do enjoy my day job I would I wouldn’t be there anymore if I didn’t like it, but there’s days where I’m like gearing up. Of course. Absolutely. You know, like in essence and this is just my way to frame this W2 work is working towards someone else’s vision, typically, and if you think of it that way, I’ve gotten behind and sold and excitably, you know, rallied people behind other people’s visions for 13 years and I do that even now today because if I believe in it I will do it. But it’s not always as natural as a purpose that you have settled on with your life partner, with your wife, you know, even with your spouse and then you wake up together and you say let’s go kick ass today. That doesn’t require anymore inspiration for me Rod, so, I would say hopefully that rant made sense.

Rod: No, no, totally, it totally did, and I know you weren’t prepared for any these questions. So you’re really landing on your feet well. What are some quotes that you and, that motivate you? Any come to mind?

Spencer: I mean, certainly in the game of the relationship building and real estate it’s the, I’m gonna butcher it, but it’s the go, if you want to go fast go alone; if you want to go far go together.

Rod: Yeah, yeah love it. Yeah, no question absolutely the truth. This is a team sport. Also liked what you said about you know go slow to go fast it’s almost a martial arts thing I think and you learn something slow and then you become very-very fast at it I love that phrase. What did you have to give up to get where you are right now my friend? What did you have to give up?

Spencer: I had to give up my Xbox Rod.

Rod: Oh my god that’s painful.

Spencer: What a hardship, you know, in hindsight, it’s funny how we all mature. I did, I do like a good video game. I don’t really use it and I bet supposed to be my kids, and focusing on the right priorities there. I’m also a musician, so I used to play in a bunch of bands, used to play guitar. I haven’t given it up. I got him hanging on the wall. I still have a big amp which I would love to use again someday, but for right now, most of them the musical performances I give is wheels on the bus to a fish blue. That is indeed funny.

Rod: Red fish, blue fish, one fish, two fish. Yeah, got it.

Spencer: That’s right.

Rod: Yeah, that’s funny. Oh, that’s hilarious.

Spencer: Sorry, sorry. I don’t rock out with metal anymore.

Rod: So let me ask you this, you know, I’ve got a lot of aspiring investors that listen to my show and you were once there and I’m so grateful that you gave me a shout out about listening to my podcast. Thank you for that, but, you know, what are you gonna tell those people that are, where you were when you first started listening and you hadn’t taken down a deal yet? What advice would you give those people?

Spencer: The advice I would give is that there comes a point where books must be translated to action, and that, playing it out in your head, like just go through the five exercise for a moment. What’s the worst that can happen in two different scenarios, worst case scenario number one; you read 30 books, you go out, you start talking to people that you’re really nervous about talking to with your newly acquired knowledge to go take it through a test drive, and maybe you say something wrong to one person and they call you out, and they say, you know what, I don’t think you explained something like cap rate correctly, I don’t think you explain that correctly, and you have that moment of social awkwardness. That is, just that moment the worst case scenario is a passing five minutes of awkwardness. That’s all that you’re fearful of, and so, I would say that’s one outcome. The other outcome would be, think about what happens worst case scenario if you don’t do that. Like if you just read the damn book and you do it over and over, and you sit down with knowledge, you do absolutely nothing with it, you feel like you’re moving forward, you’re capping out man. And I think it’s, I really do think that’s it. Is that, the worst case scenario is, you don’t do anything with it. The best case scenario is, you go out, you stumble your way through a few conversations, maybe you get a couple spreadsheets wrong but you can do those in safe environments, you can do that with people that will actually give you real, hopefully, compassionately direct feedback and they’ll actually be there on your side. Most of the real estate investing community I’m encountered Rod, are great people.

Rod: Yeah, they’re givers. They’re givers. Yeah, no question. You know, occasionally you’ll meet somebody that’s a narcissist and just not a pleasant person to be around but, you know, most people truly want to contribute. In fact, contribution is a basic human need, and in fact, I’m actually giving 1,800 backpacks. My foundation is doing 1,800 backpacks with school supplies this Saturday. I just did a Facebook alive about that but, I mean, so if you’re listening guys, success without that is not success. Success without giving back in some fashion is not success and, you know, I’m not gonna derail this conversation by explaining why but the bottom line is you need to be giving back in some fashion. So, let me ask you this, tell me about a mistake or a failure you made in this journey to 3200 doors.

Spencer: The first one that comes to mind right off the bat is, you can choose a relationship or you can choose a deal, you know, there’s those moments where maybe you’ve been talking to a new potential partner and all of a sudden you get really excited about closing on this project with them. They, maybe they’re not ready for it yet and you decide to nudge them. You send that one email to many. You send that one text to many, and in a hindsight I did that. I did that to someone. It was a few years ago, and I look back at that now and I kicked myself, you know, I try not to live without regret but I call that just a learning. And I think what I’ve learned since then Rod, is, it’s not worth it, ever to push and to feel that, if you’re working with someone, if you’re working with the team, you’re working with an individual as a partner, you ever push them to a point where it’s a short-term win, and I think it’s all about making sure, you’re totally aligned, you understand where they’re at and you end up in a place where you’re like; wow, that was really cool I’m glad we made that decision together, even if it’s something that’s gonna end up materializing a year from now. Sorry, I look at that and it’s like; gosh, I wish I could have gone back and not hit Send on that email.

Rod: Wow. Well that’s, and, you know, I’m really glad you brought that up because guys this business is a long-term game and you’ve discovered that Spence and, you know, in fact one of my friends, Glenn Gonzales I just wrote the foreword for his book, I’ll have him on when it’s on Amazon he’s from. He started out as a maintenance man and now he’s at 5,000 doors, and his book is From Maintenance Man to Millionaire but, you know, one of one of the things that he that he talked about, I have a mastermind and he’s in my mastermind had the first version here at my house my compound in Florida but, at that, he talked about how he met a guy like ten years or maybe I guess it probably twelve years ago and just befriended him, and it was a guy that owned 1,700 doors and he helped him with something. It’s something that really showed his integrity and now he owns those 1,700 doors, okay? So, you know, and this really is a small world as well, this multifamily space. You think it’s a big world, it’s really not. And so, you know, you’ve gotta look at these relationships as long-term, he also gave the example. He’s give you another one of his examples were where he was buying a property and the chiller went bad and it was a hundred thousand dollar chiller, and he could have made the broker pay for it but he sucked it up and did it because he was, he so valued that broker relationship. So that’s another extreme example of what you just described, you know, and remembering that this is a long-term game. So, I’m really glad you brought that up. So, what would you say is the best piece of advice you’ve ever received around this business?

Spencer: Oh man. I gotta think about that one first. You know, I guess the best advice that I would give or the best advice I’ve ever received would be about immersion, you know, I think it’s about saying go all-in don’t make it a hobby. If you make it a hobby, you’re gonna spin your knees.

Rod: I’m so glad you said that. I’m so glad you said that because it allows me to say what I’m gonna say next and that is, for God’s sakes come see me at one of my boot camps, if you haven’t done this business because that is total immersion. But as a flip on what you just said you’re either in or you’re out. There’s no halfway in. You don’t have one foot in, one foot out, you know. It’s like the Latin word, root for the word decision means to cut off and a great example is if your attack in the island, you burned ships cuz you’re gonna take their ships home. It’s done, and that’s total immersion. Yeah, I love it. love it. I’m so good you brought that up.

Spencer: Just to give a real example for the audience Rod. A couple books I’ve read, you’ve been to kind of propose this, I would say, if it sounds extreme to someone I can see why but I am so deadly serious about its effectiveness. If you wanna get started, let’s say you’re already in a day job, you’re in W2 career, if you wanna make a switch and you’re serious about pursuing this path, go look for jobs in the industry for your day job, like find a place that is a line for that industry, you maybe even if that maybe it’s a downgrade and like, just think play that out. It’s like maybe you’re a VP in a software company. Maybe you are doing marketing. What if all, if you find out, I wanna go into real estate. I want to be active. I got advice a while back that also said don’t quit your day job immediately. Do it in phases. Build up your revenue over time outside your day job. So, if there’s two things you get from doing that, ignore the damn title. It’s not about the title. Go find a place that will pay you to learn and just humble yourself, like, I got humbled so hard by so many tough experiences in my day in my corporate career, mentors that just hold me deeply accountable, and so I try to operate in an egoless fashion but you got to get over the title and just go find how to get close to the work and get paid to go to school. That’s basically what it means if you want to go into real estate. I’ve stumbled into that when joining a real estate company that was a lender. So suddenly I’m sitting there staring at these deals and looking at how to get a profitable flip and I’m managing people who are loan originator. I’m getting license to them sitting there going. I know people who are making more cash than I am on their day job but I am learning invaluable skills and, analytically, I really recommend that strategy for people.

Rod: I love it. And guys, there’s so many things you can do. You can get into appraising. You can get into property management real estate sales. You know, go work at one of the big brokers, you know, there’s so many ways you can immerse yourself in this business. The way you just described. So, love it. A lending, like yours, you know, just …

Spencer: Totally.

Rod: Awesome. So, what’s a question that I didn’t ask that you wish I had Spence?

Spencer: Oh man. When is the right time to get started?

Rod: Yeah. I usually end with that one and I didn’t with you. So, yeah. Let me ask a different one though that kind of ties in to that and that is, you know, if you were gonna tell yourself, you know, I don’t know how old you are you look like you’re in your 30s but let’s say, you’re twenty …

Spencer: 36.

Rod: 36, okay. Let’s so, if you’re gonna tell your 22-year-old self something about this business, specifically, you know, would you’ve started sooner? What would you tell yourself? What would you, you know, what might be different? If anything, maybe nothing.

Spencer: No, it’ll be really specific with this one. It’s probably going to hit home for a few folks. I was living in Denver, Colorado in 2009. I believe, I’m sure the data, the data heads out, there will debating on this one. I saw some stats as recently as a month ago that said single-family home values in Denver, Colorado was the biggest delta positive way out of any city in the United States over the past 10 years.

Rod: I’m glad that you had to go there. You had to go there. Do you now painful what you just said is for me. You probably have no idea. I used to owned 500 houses there, okay? It’s my biggest, that’s one of my biggest regrets. If I still owned those damn houses they’d be free and clear and I’m getting a half a million dollars a month minimum, half a million. But, you know, and the only way I justify it, is I wouldn’t have met my wife if I hadn’t sold them. So, you know, that’s how I justify it but why did you have to use that freaking examples Spence. Anyway, finish your story. I’m sorry, it’s just it, you know, I had to interrupt because it’s yeah.

Spencer: Or that means it’s the best topic to bring up, right? A story is best learning for people. Funny story on that topic to Rod. I am moved back out to Colorado. I went to school there originally, in Boulder, went back years later. You know, it was also a time when my wife took me back. My wife took me back here of living out there so that helped, but I was sitting there renting, probably, there like one of the nicest apartments. Say anything I was some kind of, some kind of hot something, you know, and I was about a 200, 300 feet away probably from a couple places I could have bought right. Just bought it an excellent deal. Just excellent-excellent deal. I bought nothing and, you know, at the time I was contributing to my 401k in my day job, I was driving to work in a car that I probably shouldn’t have urges and all these stupid things, and if I look back that has to be it. I try to live without regret but I will say that it probably doesn’t compare to yours. Yeah.

Rod: That’s awesome and I’m, you know, I’m really glad you brought it up and, you know, it is what it is but yeah that did hammer home for me. It’s funny you said Boulder, I was just there last weekend. I had my mastermind, you know, I’ve got a mastermind with hitters. I’m over five billion in assets in there now and …

Spencer: Wow.

Rod: And we had it, we did our excursion was to hike the Flatirons on Saturday. We meet on Thursday and Friday and then we hiked the Flatirons on Saturday, and there we’re gonna meet next in in Sarasota and on Saturday we’re actually gonna do my basket brigade where we’re gonna feed 1,500 families for Thanksgiving so that’ll be fun in November. But anyway, listen my friend I really appreciate you being on the show. You’ve added tremendous value and I’m really glad we got to know each other because I’m really I’ve really enjoyed having this chat with you so and I know that we’re gonna stay in touch and thank you.

Spencer: It’s been an honor Rod. Seriously, I’ve been following me for years. I can’t tell you how much I appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Rod: My pleasure brother.

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