Bonnie Schwam is a highly accomplished real estate agent and experienced investor specializing in multifamily properties and self-storage facilities. With a proven track record of success, Bonnie combines her extensive knowledge of the real estate market with her passion for investment opportunities to help clients achieve their financial goals. She prides herself on having a customer-centric approach, providing personalized solutions and expert guidance throughout every step of the real estate transaction process.
Here’s some of the topics we covered:
- From Getting A Real Estate License To Multifamily
- How Real Estate Agents Skills Can Apply To Multifamily
- How Bonnie Joined Rod Kheilf’s Warrior Program
- The Self Storage Asset Class & Multifamily
- The Ins & Outs Of Multifamily Syndication
- Being Fearful But Taking Action Anyway
- Underwriting Is One Of The Most Important Aspects of Multifamily
To Apply for The Warrior Program: Text CRUSH to 72345 and we’ll help you crush it in this business.
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Full Transcript Below
Intro
Hi, my name is Rod Khleif, and I’m the host of “The Lifetime Cashflow Through Real Estate Investing” podcast. And every week, I interview Multifamily Rock Stars and we talk about how they build incredible wealth for themselves and their families through multifamily properties. So hit the “Like” and “Subscribe” buttons to get notified every Monday when a new episode comes out. Let’s get to it.
Rod
Welcome back to Multifamily Rock Stars. So as you guys know, this is where we interview people that are just flat-out crushing it in this business. And we show you the inside scoop as to how multifamily investors are creating massive success in their businesses and in their lives. And as always, we’ve got our co-host, who’s the director of our Massive Action team for the warrior group, Mark Nagy.
Mark
Happy to be here as always and do another one.
Rod
Yes, sir. Well, we’ve got a real treat, somebody I really like in the Warrior program on today. Her name is Bonnie Schwam, and Bonnie is flat-out crushing it. Now, she is in 1,400 plus doors as a Limited Partner, but she’s also a General Partner in a bunch of self-storage units, like upwards of 2,600. And so we’re going to have a lot of fun today. And just such a treat to have you on, Bonnie.
Bonnie
Oh, my gosh. I was so excited to be here. And may I say that Rod is one of my favorite people on the planet.
Rod
Stop it. Stop it. Stop it. Stop it.
Bonnie
Well, you are.
Rod
Thank you, Bonnie. Well, listen, why don’t you start by you know, telling us a little bit of who you are? Give us kind of a high-level overview of your background in business and why you ended up in multifamily and maybe why you ended up in the Warrior group.
Bonnie
Well, thank you for asking. I think it’s very one of the things I do have a broadcast journalism degree. I have a communications degree, so I spent a good amount of time on TV and radio. And then I was also in banking, so I had a financial background. And then I found as far as I became a realtor in 2005 is when I got my broker’s license in Colorado. That’s where I’m from. And so I have been practicing real estate. And that word is practice. I’m practicing real estate ever since. And it is one of the things it’s always such a changing market, you know. But the very first home I ever bought was when I was 19.
Rod
In Denver or where?
Bonnie
I bought it in Colorado Springs.
Rod
Colorado Springs, okay.
Bonnie
It was $20,000.
Rod
Wow.
Bonnie
That is not the price now, I can tell you that.
Rod
What year was that? Do you recall?
Bonnie
No, you’re not supposed to ask [inaudible]
Rod
I was trying to be sneaky. I was trying to be sneaky. You felt– you didn’t fall for it.
Bonnie
Yeah, I didn’t fall for it. We’re close in the same age. But that’s it.
Rod
Are we? Okay. Well, it’s funny. You’re a Colorado broker. I was just telling you before we started recording, I actually got my Colorado broker’s license right when I turned 18, which they allowed you to do back then with education. Now you’ve got to have some freaking experience, obviously. But I was still living at home. I could add my own office, broker’s office. Thank God I was smart enough to work for another broker. But anyway, so continue. So you’ve got quite a story, quite a varied background from journalism to finance to real estate.
Bonnie
Yeah, isn’t that fun? Yeah, I started a couple of radio stations. So, as far as why the thing is, I always wanted to be in multifamily. Even when I got my real estate license, I knew I wanted to go to my own investment. Does that make sense? But I knew that I needed to have, or I felt like, at that point, I needed to have the finances in order to do that. And I was thinking about one in particular, I don’t even know how many years, maybe like ten years ago, I was in a little condo because I had a house over in the mountains and I was on the Front Range doing media and I was staying there and the guy, I said, I’m going to go back to the mountains. And he said, well, you can sell my condo and I’ll sell it to you for 75,000. And I thought that’s a terrific price. So I did everything I could do. I had good credit, but I had multiple houses. Does that make sense? So they were like going, you don’t qualify. I’m like, what do you mean I don’t qualify? I’m giving you half of it down. It was the most frustrating and ridiculous thing I had ever heard. So I ended up selling it for $125,000 for him. And then two years later, I sold for $250,000. And so I think of about the amount of money that I would have made on that one little unit in a couple of years. And I thought, there’s got to be a better way.
Rod
You know, and that ties right into the difference between residential financing and commercial financing. And with residential financing, they’re going to look at you and they’ve got very strict parameters as it relates to occupancy and the number of, for example, Fannie Mae loans you can get. And it’s much more tightly regulated than the commercial space because it’s all geared around protecting the borrower, protecting the consumer, but it’s very onerous.
Mark
So I know you have a real estate agent background, Bonnie, and we have a lot of real estate agents that listen to this. I’ve talked to tons over the years. But how do you think real estate agents, or even maybe just salespeople in general, can take that skill set and then practically apply it into multifamily and doing this business?
Bonnie
Well, I think as far as one of the things that realtors do is that we assess the market. We always have our finger and pulse on the market. What is the market doing, you know? And each area can be so different. Each area, even in the city, can be so different in terms of desirability and what the amount, the prices will be like when we’re pricing homes and stuff like that. So what I see is a real estate agent is that we already have that knowledge of markets, or maybe there are markets that we grew up in, or maybe there are markets we sell in now, or maybe there are markets that we’re just reading and learning about. And so our experience about how to do a comparative market analysis or how to– you know, when we do what they call boots on the ground when we actually go to a property, I mean, you can pretty well tell. I can go to a property and pretty well tell you if that would be something I’d be interested in, even by looking around, you know.
Rod
Just like you said with that condo, like that condo, you know instantly it was a screaming deal. And that’s a huge benefit, right?
Bonnie
Yeah.
Rod
You know, I just realized we didn’t let you finish telling your story because we didn’t talk about how you got into our program and the progression there. So I’d like you to go back to that if you wouldn’t mind.
Bonnie
So basically, I think as far as one person that we both know, Mr. Cardone, Mr. 10X, was really pretty good with his stuff on social media. And so he got me into a boot camp that– you know, I think you call it a business boot camp, yes, down in Miami, Aventura. So I went down there with my fiancee because I thought it would be good for both of us to do that. And I just kind of wanted to see what he was like. And at that same time, he then began said, I’m going to have a real estate seminar event right after this. And I went, what? I would have come to that because I was like, oh, my gosh, that was kind of an answer. So I went ahead and stayed for that. And I just remember as far as I know that some people worry about– like some people don’t invest in themselves. And I remember sitting there and I was going to join his real estate club, and it was a pretty good sum of money. And I remember crying. I remember crying because I said, oh, my God. I have never spent this kind of money on myself to improve myself. And this is what I want to do. And this is what I’ve always wanted to do. So it was like, I set that and I believed that I would 10X my business. And that was probably, honestly, one of the best years that I’ve had in real estate. So I went, oh, my God, I made this investment, but I 10Xed it, right? So I got to meet a lot of the 10X people there. And then they were telling me about this other person named Rod Khleif and the Warriors program. And I thought, I’ve never heard of Rod Khleif. Who is that? And so then they began, come on, we’re all going to go there and we’re going to be there in Denver. So I said, well, Denver is close, I can do that. And so I went there and I was just thoroughly impressed with you and with the Warriors and the stories and the people. And I just knew that I had to be a part of you guys. And I was like, this is my tribe. These are my people.
Rod
That’s very kind. Yeah. That was my Denver boot camp. And I remember that was a very, very special boot camp for me because my mom was there and she died not that long after that. And I was behind the curtain crying like a little girl because she’s the reason I got into real estate. And so that was a very, very special event for me. And by the way, if you’re listening and you were at that event, we somehow accidentally recorded over the video of my mom and I. And if you have any pictures or videos of that event, I’d be super grateful if you let me know because it was really such a disappointment because that was such a special moment. And we accidentally recorded over it, my previous AV guy. Operative word, previous AV guy. Anyway, well, that’s really cool. And, you know, you’ve been in the Warrior program now since, what is that? July of last year.
Bonnie
Right.
Rod
And look at you. Look at you. Wow. Just killing it.
Bonnie
I know. I have my sword down. I was like, these people have their swords.
Rod
Just so you know what we’re talking about here. So in our Warrior program, when you get your first deal as a Warrior, you get this cool sword and you become a Warrior of the sword. And it is like this really cool sword. It’s like a real sword. So that’s what she’s talking about there.
Mark
Well, I wanted to mention that because we were just talking that you did this deal with another Warrior coach. Other Warriors are involved in the deal, I know. And it’s a self-storage deal. It’s a perfect transition. What do you think would be some of those reasons for someone wanting to get into self-storage? I don’t want to say instead of multifamily, but maybe to supplement multifamily.
Bonnie
Well, I think as far as I know that the 1,400 plus doors I have as a Limited Partner are Class-A properties. Right?
Rod
They’re multifamily properties.
Bonnie
Yeah.
Rod
Right.
Bonnie
And, you know, so I thought, but all of a sudden I woke up one day, I couldn’t even tell you how it happened, but I went, I love self-storage. And I have a saying that says “It ain’t sexy, but it’s stable”. So self-storage is stable. It’s like, no matter what the market, if it’s good or bad, people–
Rod
People pay to keep their stuff.
Bonnie
Yes.
Rod
George Carlin–
Bonnie
They got to let go of it. And when people talk–
Rod
I’m sorry, I interrupted. I was just thinking about that this morning when I was thinking I was going to interview you. George Carlin, when he was alive, did a skit about stuff. And if you Google George Carlin’s stuff, it is hilarious about people just don’t let go of their freaking stuff. And I’m a poster child for that, by the way, because I got so much crap here in my company. I got six buildings and I’m running out of room. So, you know, I’m a poster child for that. But please continue. I’m sorry I interrupted you as you [inaudible]
Bonnie
But I’m going to say that I love people like you that can’t get rid of their stuff because then that allows me to have self-storage units and you happily pay that. Or other people, they go, oh, my mother’s had it for 40 years and she keeps paying $200 a month. She doesn’t even know what’s in there. I said, well, tell your mother thank you. So to me, self-storage is– what do they say? You don’t have toilets, you don’t have tenants, and a lot of times don’t have termites.
Rod
We’ve got quite a few Warriors that are killing it in that space, too. And I know you partnered with one of them, which is great. There are other asset classes represented in the Warrior community. You know, self-storage is one of them. Mobile home parks is another. And certainly mixed-use retail, development, all of that. There are people that do all of that.
Mark
And I have some curiosity on this because I would imagine– you tell me if I’m wrong, Bonnie, part of the reason why self-storage, maybe there’s not as much value add, but it’s more cash flow. Is that the case that it’s more of a cash-flowing asset? There are not a lot of value ads. What are the pros and cons?
Bonnie
Well, this particular asset that we bought down in and around Beaumont, Texas. There are seven locations. It is a total value add. I mean, as far as we closed on it, probably three or four months ago, we’re now stabilizing the asset and we’re looking at a lot of that. We have to do repairs, we have to get rid of things, we have to change rents, all that kind of stuff. I think there’s going to be a storage war coming up, you know, those storage wars. We’re going to do a bunch of that. So to me, it’s like the people that I did some capital raising for this, the people that came in, you know because it was a 506(b). And I think that’s one thing that people don’t understand is what you can say and not say with those things. So it was like, it had to be people that know me, like me, and hopefully trust me that invested.
Rod
It actually had to be people that you already had a substantive pre-existing relationship with. And so what she’s talking about– let me interrupt for one second because you threw a number out there that might intimidate some people. They don’t know what you mean. So in our world, in the commercial real estate space, there are typically two types of syndications that you’ll see. You’ll see a 506(b), which is what Bonnie just described, which has really been around forever. When I got in the business, that’s what it was. There used to be what they called a three-touch rule. That meant you have to have talked to somebody three times before you could tell them about a deal. And with the Dodd-Frank Act you know, in the last– I forgot when it happened, but not that far back, they came out with a 506(c). And the 506(c), you could advertise. Now, the 506(b) you absolutely cannot advertise, but a 506(c) you can advertise. I talk about deals on my podcast because that’s all I do is 506(c) deals. So just to clear that up. Now, I am going to be doing a masterclass on syndication here at some point, probably in the next month or two. Just so you guys know, just keep an eye out on my Rod Khleif official Facebook page. I just did one on finding deals. I’ll be doing another one on raising capital and another one on– oh, gosh. Oh, thriving in this upcoming recession. But anyway, 506(b) and 506(c), those are the two most common ways that people will do a syndication. Now, there’s also what’s called a Reg A+, which is much more complicated. And I’m not going to drill down on that right now with you guys. But anyway, just wanted to clarify that.
Bonnie
So that was the one thing is– I have been in sales and marketing and real estate for a really long time. But this, I mean, it was kind of like you had to– I had called so many people. I talked to so many people. It was such an educational experience. We have a women’s Warrior group, and I’m sharing my experience with them because it was literally brand new to me what I was doing. And because these people were people that I knew, it was even a little more intimidating than somebody I didn’t know. I don’t know if that makes sense, but it was like–
Rod
No, it sure does.
Bonnie
Somebody that I knew for money than people that I didn’t. So it was like, oh, that was tough.
Rod
Oh, you had to step up, but it was exciting, right? I mean, you had to step up, but you had people to help you. You had people to hold your hand and just get through it. But let me ask you a question. Let me go back to something. You know, you paid a lot of money for Grant’s program, and I love Grant. He’s been on the show twice. I mean, I went to his GrowthCon in Vegas. I paid for front row seats and paid a lot of money for front row seats.
Bonnie
Yes, he did.
Rod
Yeah, he’s a good guy. But my question to you is, you were already in his program. Why did you join ours?
Bonnie
As far as for me, I felt like what Grant did when I joined his program was that he allowed me to see that– he allowed me to dream.
Rod
Yeah, he does that.
Bonnie
It’s like, here you can be and do whatever you want and it’s going to happen, right? But the issue was, I mean, not an issue, but it was just like, I needed more foundation. I could shoot for the sky, but I needed to know how to get there. I needed a foundation.
Rod
You need to have a gun. You need to have a gun to shoot for the sky. You need to know what to aim for. Got it. No, you know, I knew you were going to say something like that. And boy, I mean, Grant is great at getting you to think outside your comfort zone. I mean, he’s on a yacht right now. I just saw him posted. He’s on a yacht somewhere in the Mediterranean with his family. Cool as hell. But, you know, we’ve had a lot of people come over from Grant’s program and from other thought leaders in this space. We don’t need to name any names, but, you know, we’re really blessed to have that. And I was just curious if you had the same answer that I’ve heard in the past. So, you know, on the note about the Warrior program, if you’re considering possibly getting some guidance so that you can experience the life that you want now rather than later, or maybe you just thought you could be more effective in getting more of the detail like Bonnie did, text the word “crush” to “72345”. And that’s how you apply. And, you know, we’ll help you overcome that. We’ll help you get ranked– you know, we’ll help you crush it and help you accomplish what you want, which is really lifetime cash flow. And I know that’s what you want, Bonnie, right? I mean, that’s why you’re here. And you needed the mechanics, and that’s what you got. And of course, the community is like second to none. Would you agree with me on that?
Bonnie
Oh, I know. I think as far as– yes, you’re right. I wanted to have income that you know we get to a point that we don’t want– we want to stop working hard for our money, and we want our money to work hard for us.
Rod
Right.
Bonnie
And so to me, it’s like, I want to be able to experience other things. And so that’s one of the things that multifamily can offer people. But also the community. When I went to your boot camp last year, it was good. It was comforting to know that other people that I had been in with 10X were also in this group and they had recommended you to me. So I thought that one of the great things about your program is that you actually get a coach. And so there was a lot of people that were on the stage and they all had amazing qualifications. And I was like, I was so excited to see who I would get.
Rod
Yeah. So you were there then. So you knew who you were going to get. You’re like, I want him. Got it. Oh, that’s fantastic. And that’s so important because you know, what I do when I’m trying to line out a new student with a coach is I really try to match personality because all our coaches are rock stars. Most of them have at least 1,000 units themselves, and they’re not professional coaches. I mean, that takes two or three students, maybe a couple more than that, but that’s it, max. Some of them only take one. And so, you know, and for me, it’s about matching of personalities. And so you were able to recognize the personality that you wanted while you were there, which that’s pretty freaking cool. So let me ask you this. You know that I do these Own Your Power clips every week where I talk about motivation and mindset. You’ve heard me tell my story, lost my butt in 2008 and ’09, and how I recovered from that. But, you know, you’re very motivating and motivated. And so, what juices you? What gets you to jump out of bed? Because you always got a radiant smile. You know, you’re always happy, and that’s why I was really happy to interview you today. But what’s the juice to get you going? What’s your why?
Bonnie
I think my why is like the name of my business, legacy. Legacy Builders Investments. I’m at the point that I want to leave a legacy of real estate, of multifamily, of all those kinds of things to my children and my grandchildren. So that’s my juice is that I enjoy doing that. I want to learn more. My kids are now getting involved in it. They’re also– just an FYI, I have three daughters and two are realtors, believe it or not.
Rod
No kidding.
Bonnie
And my third daughter actually works for what is that really big company now? I can’t think of it now that I said that. It’s a big commercial company. Cushman.
Rod
Real Estate? She works for Cushman? Wow, they’re huge.
Bonnie
Yeah. So I’m sitting there going, so we’re all kind of in that. And she would be an amazing asset manager. So that’s the time I look at her and I go, oh–
Rod
I hope you’ll drag them to the September boot camp in Orlando. That’ll be awesome if they can come. You know, I’d love to see them. So it seems [inaudible] I bet that.
Bonnie
Well, Rod, I did house some people that I am really talking to about going to Orlando with me.
Rod
Fantastic. Awesome. Well, they’ll be glad they came. As you know, because they’re a lot of fun. I mean, people laugh, they cry, they have a good time. We really make it entertaining. You know, because I spend a lot of time on mindset, it’s not just all the dry material that we have to go through as well. So let me ask you this, Bonnie, kind of an unusual question. How has your life been different than you might have imagined?
Bonnie
I think as far as one thing I would say is that I never let fear get in the way. I mean, I can be fearful about something, but I do it anyway. Jumping out of an airplane, starting a radio station, making capital fundraising calls. I mean, you just do it as far as– I would say that I’m in a play as well. And one of my lines is, “And I have no regrets”.
Rod
Oh, I love that. And, you know, I so love what you just said because there are people listening that haven’t made a move on you know, creating the life they deserve, you know, out of fear, out of limiting beliefs, or they’re comfortable. They haven’t made a move and they know they want to do something. Because sometimes we’ll ask, how did you push through the fear of actually doing this? And you’re like, you just did it. And that’s beautiful because action mitigates fear. And so, you know, that massive action, it’s only a couple of seconds of fear. And everybody has fear. It doesn’t matter who you are. The successful people push through it. And so I’m really glad you said that. That absolutely added value today.
Mark
So speaking of fear, I’d love to end on a technical, some practical gold nuggets, maybe that some listeners– because I know people are looking at the market, obviously, interest rates, duh, that’s one that’s killing a lot of deals, insurance in particular markets, taxes, those are things that are killing a lot of deals right now. But yeah, you just have to be educated on it. And I know you mentioned market analysis is something you’re really good at. What are maybe some specific roadblocks, newbies right now? They’re sitting on the sideline, but they want to get educated on buying deals. What are some of those things that newbies should be looking for, keeping an eye out in this particular market moving forward, do you think?
Bonnie
Well, I think as far as really learning, again, the foundations. If you have to learn the foundations, you have to learn basic underwriting. You have to be able to do that. And if you don’t, there are plenty of people in the Warrior’s group that will help you. And then a part of it is once you decide, oh, I want to do apartments, or, oh, I want to do self-storage, or, oh, I want to do mobile homes, that you look within the ecosystem of the Warrior group to find those people. Like I found–
Rod
Or outside of it, if you don’t want to join, you know, let’s not make this just about the Warrior group, but find those people that will help you grow in this in whatever it is, right?
Bonnie
It’s true. And the meet-up groups and stuff like that within their local communities that are other like-minded people that want to do investing in commercial and multifamily. So just kind of put yourself out there. I look at a lot of YouTube. I watch other people that are kind of in that space, what they’re saying, what they’re talking about, and then kind of narrow in. That was one thing that my coach really taught me was narrow in on the areas that you want to invest. For a while, Colorado was ridiculous to invest. It was like, wow. Because we’re one of the highest states in the country, right? Not just elevation, but I mean, as far as pricing. So it was kind of like people were going, oh, I’m going to go to Florida. I’m going to go to Texas. And so it’s important– and that’s one thing that my coach told me was concentrate on two or three areas and then hit burst in those areas. So the area where I used to live or the area, you know, maybe Texas, that’s where I’ve invested. Or Florida, a lot of people invested there, or Tennessee. But it doesn’t have to be those states. It’s what state that you feel like that’s where you want to put your money and where you want to put your time. And so don’t be shooting like a cannon all over, but more concentrated–
Rod
Focus, focus. Focus is power. And that’s what we teach. So good work there for sure. So, Bonnie, let me kind of land the plane or finish our conversation with this question I like to ask on, you know, a fairly regular basis. If you could go back and tell 18-year-old Bonnie something, knowing what you know now, what might you do differently as it relates to real estate or multifamily or investing, if anything?
Bonnie
Yeah, there is something. As far as my older brother has been a real estate agent, a single-family real estate agent for 45 years. And when I wanted to become a realtor, he said, you can’t do that. You can’t do that because you’re not going to have enough money saved up and da da da da da. Giving me all the reasons why I couldn’t and none of the reasons why I could. And so my younger self would tell my brother to pound sand. No, I tell my brother, you’re wrong, I can do it. And I’ve done it. And that would be the difference that I would make. I would have started real estate probably way earlier and be further along in my multifamily journey than I am now.
Rod
That’s not uncommon. That’s not an uncommon thing. You know, when you first have that dream, it’s a fragile thread, and you have to protect that thread. And that’s why you know, I spend so much time talking about your environment and the people you allow to influence you because it’s very easy for that thread to be broken until you’ve really shorted up and so on and so forth. Because people will break it out of their fear of failure, their fear of feeling left behind, their fear of rejection, you know, their own limiting beliefs and fears. And sometimes it’s family, like in your case, you know, you got to love your family, but you got to choose who you allow to influence you. That was a very helpful, very great example, Bonnie. Well, it’s such a treat to see you. And thank you so much for coming on. And I can’t wait to see you at the boot camp in September. And I’m sure we’ll see you at the Warrior event as well. Those are just for the Warriors. We have a lot of fun regardless. There’ll be a ton of Warriors at the boot camp as well. But anyways, great to see you, and look forward to giving you a hug soon.
Bonnie
Oh, absolutely. I look forward to that hug as well.
Rod
All right. Take care.
Bonnie
Thank you.
Rod
All right, thanks.
Outro
So one other quick thing. We encounter so many people that are, frankly, frustrated. They’re looking in the mirror and they’re frustrated that they haven’t been able to escape the rat race. They haven’t been able to build cash flow to the point where they’re able to have financial and time freedom with their families and maybe they see other people buying real estate and creating incredible cash flow and they think, well, it’s just scary. You know, buying apartments is intimidating. And I get it. See, that’s why we created our Warrior Mentorship Program. They’re our coaching students and they’ve had extraordinary results. My students, I’ve been teaching about five years and they own upwards of 140,000 units now that we know of. And we feel like it’s just getting going. Now, we’re looking to grow this group and really take it to the next level and honestly believe that the greatest transfer of wealth could be upon us right now with this current economic environment. Everything’s going on sale. So we’re looking for people who want to follow a proven framework, really like a blueprint or a map, literally step by step. And then they’re able to leverage our systems and our incredible network to raise money and equity to find deals and close those deals and build partnerships, really nationwide. So if you’re interested in finding out more about how you can become more in our incredible network and take advantage of the unbelievable opportunities that are upon us, you can apply to my Warrior Mentorship Program by texting the word “CRUSH” to “72345”, or you can go to “MentorWithRod.com”, and what we’ll do is we’ll set up a call so you can check us out and we can check you out and see if it’s a fit. Now, again, you can go to “MentorWithRod.com” or text the word “CRUSH” to “72345” to apply, and we will speak soon.
