Ep #449 – Kyle Wilson – Building Your Audience and Reach
The power of adding value
- Desperation vs Inspiration
- Asking better questions
- The wheel of engagement
- Value to the marketplace
- Value to valuable people
- Adding spokes to your wheel
- Part of core business?
- Represent your secret sauce?
- Focused on right people?
- Everyone starts at zero
- How much influence do you want to have?
- Prime time for business building
- Top of the funnel strategies
- Continuing the conversation
Find out more about our guest here
Full Transcript Below
Ep #449 – Kyle Wilson – Building Your Audience and Reach
Hi my name is Rod Khleif and I’m the host of the “Lifetime Cashflow through Real Estate Investing Podcast” and every week I interview Multifamily Rockstars. We talk about how they built incredible wealth for themselves and their families through multifamily properties. So hit the like and subscribe button and get notified every Monday when a new episode comes out. Let’s get to it.
Rod: Welcome to another edition of How to Build Lifetime Cashflow through Real Estate Investing. I’m Rod Khleif and I am thrilled that you’re here. And I am super excited to have a chat with the gentleman that I’m interviewing today and here’s why. So you guys all know I spent 20 years following Tony Robbins around the planet and you know I was on his team for eight years and I love mindset and if you don’t know that you haven’t listened to one of my episodes and so the gentleman that we’re interviewing today well what you may not know is that Tony Robbins got his start with a gentleman named Jim Rohn and that’s another gentleman I would recommend. He’s no longer with us that you listen to his material because it’s fantastic. Well, the gentleman I’m interviewing today, Kyle Wilson, is the founder of Jim Rohn International. He’s also the founder of yoursuccessstore.com and his own website is KyleWilson.com, now he has worked with people like Brian Tracy, Les Brown, Darren Hardy, you know Denis Waitley, Robin Sharma, all these huge names people like Mark Victor Hansen, Chicken Soup for the Soul, Jack Canfield. He’s done seminars but you know I’m super excited to talk to Kyle today because again that you know you guys know I love this stuff. Anything around mindset in psychology. So without further ado, welcome to show my friend
Kyle: Hey thank you so much Rod. I’m honored
Rod: Yeah no… This is gonna be a lot of fun. So you know why don’t although this is not gonna be a real-estate conversation. Guys you do want to listen though because we’re gonna talk about how to build a list and you guys know in this business you know you must create reach because it’s a team sport you’re gonna want to get out there in front of sellers and brokers and investors. And so the topic of today’s you know one of the one of the big topics and who knows we’re gonna go all over the place today but one of them is building your list. And so let’s go back if you don’t mind and just talk for little bit about how you got into the personal development space you know where it all started for you Kyle
Kyle: No. Thank You Rod. I grew up in a small town Vernon, Texas. I never went to college. I actually, I remember someone once saying, Kyle, how would you do to eventually become Jim Rohn’s business partner? And it’s like well you know to be candid I did drugs you know I wasn’t the class president. I was on the other side of that equation. But at age 19, I had a significant emotional experience. I made a change. I started first of a series of businesses and at age 26, I said I kind of done what I think I can do in the town I lived in. Sold my business, sold my house, moved to Dallas and rod just a series of serendipitous things led me to eventually, it’s just too crazy of a story that led me to eventually attending a seminar and I went to this seminar the guy putting it on, had a call to action, I just lost my job and one of the few jobs I’ve ever had my life I’ve always been an entrepreneur I’m not really employable and he said listen we’re hiring local sales reps and I was the last guy. I mean there was a room of like 30 people and I was the last guy terrified to speak in front of five people had never really been in sales. I’ve been an entrepreneur but didn’t know sells. But it’s the story of I was the last man standing you know six months later I’m the only guy left out of everyone he tried to recruit to do seminars
Rod: And this is Jim Rohn? this is Jim Rohn we’re talking about?
Kyle: No this is before Jim
Rod: Oh before Jim okay
Kyle: Yeah and I ended up, I was desperate you know Jim and Tony both talk about desperation you know we do things for one of two reasons, inspiration or desperation. I was desperate. I was a little bit in this bubble I was inspired and I ended up becoming his number one sales rep. And one day I got a call and he was doing these all over the country and he said listen my mentor Jim Rohn is coming back out of retirement. We’re start promoting him and you’re in Dallas I’m going to Los Angeles. Texas is yours and that was 1990. I started the seminar business 1989, 1990. I was getting to 300 people you know I’d do a you know a hundred phone calls a day cold calling to book yourself, to go speak at companies, to then do a couple of meetings you know the story then you sell tickets at the end. And Jim was so good and I really learned to leverage referrals and I started doing things that I wasn’t initially taught to do. And being the number one guy, and I wasn’t working for Jim was working for the guy who was promoting Jim. And I was the number one guy but I wasn’t making any money. And I said okay the system’s broke. I’m gonna have to go out on my own and so my mantra was how do I get 2,000 people in a room and I just constantly, how do I get 2,000 people in the room. So I left that company and my first big event was Augmon Dino and Brian Tracy
Rod: Wow I haven’t heard that name in a long time
Kyle: Yeah got 1,300 people then which Chicago got 1,800 then went to DC got 2,100 and by then I was hiring Jim from Jerry because I said Jim’s the best so I’m doing a combination of Jim Rohn and Brian Tracy and Augmon Dino that you know and eventually that model totally broke in Jim one day said, hey Kyle because I think I had twenty six hundred people in Sacramento and he said hey Kyle did you ever pay Jerry? And I’m like oh yeah no we sold 50,000 a product and I was paying triple Jim’s fee because that was the cost for me to have access to him. He said well you know he owes me $450,000 and so this next event is pay me directly and I’ll take it out of the cut you know that he owes me. So that next event after the event Jim and I got together and he said that partnership with Jerry was you know they stopped. It was going, it had gotten worse since we last talked. And I said, well a few guys are definitely done, I would love an opportunity to have exclusive rights to go market you I think you’re the best speaker in the world. I’m a pretty good promoter. And Rod, you go back to the Tony Robbins stage, Jim would talk about that was adventures and achievement. And he said, we were filling up all these rooms and after we lost $800,000 we finally shut it down and so this was that second experience. So I knew he wasn’t looking for a partner. So I said look give me exclusive rights, I will take you out to the marketplace and I’ll just pay you off the top. I’ll pay you. I’ll pay for everything, the staff, the team, marketing, and I’ll pay you off the top. We did a handshake. That handshake lasted for 10 years before we finally put it on one piece of paper, one sheet of paper. But that first year Rod, I was able to take Jim from 20 speaking dates at 4,000 to a 110 dates at 10,000. I started creating products, this thing called, “The Will” which was very powerful. Led to a bit of a God download where I created this viral marketing tool that we moved six million of and you know the race was on. And what I found out pretty quickly was, people loved Jim Rohn. And once I could get them on the wheel and take him around to buy his one day or his two day or his book or his audio, we didn’t have anything left. And Jim wasn’t ambitious to create a lot of products. Over a long period of time, I did create a lot but that’s when I started Your Success Story and I said, listen, if I can book Jim for this company then the next year bring Brian Tracy in or Les Brown in or Denis Waitley in. And so I then became the agent for Denis Waitley, multiple speakers and I started creating products and doing events with these other speakers as well.
Rod: By the way guys, if you don’t recognize these names, they’re big luminaries in the self-actualization and self development space. Every one of these names is huge Brian Tracy, Les Brown, Darren Hardy, used to own success magazine. I think Denis Waitley, huge Robin Sharma, huge, these are big big names in that space. So please continue
Kyle: You know I always say, we learn by doing. So, I didn’t know what it was to cold-call and you know go book yourself and become a promoter and fill up rooms. I sure didn’t know what it was like to be an agent and you know Brian Tracy taught me way back then, take something that works but then innovate. And so, I would always, and it’s a thing on the wheel and we can get into the wheel a little bit later. But that led to a series of questions about what it’s the most strategic thing I can do the one thing I can do that’s gonna knock down all the dominoes.
Rod: Can I stop you? I’m sorry to interrupt. I want to stop you just for a moment because guys I don’t know if you’ve noticed this but Kyle asks himself profound questions like he mentioned a little bit earlier and I just want to flag this because this is so critical because your life is driven by the quality the questions you ask yourself. So he asked himself how do I put two thousand people in a room over and over again and you just presented another question I didn’t forgot the question but I just want to flag the fact that I want my listeners to make note of that because when you ask a better-quality question, you get a better result. So anyway forgive me I just want to you know
Kyle: No, that’s great and it’s so true you know. I always say marketing. I do this thing called seven principles to build your business and brand and the number one thing is connecting the dots. Marketing is not about being clever and manipulative. It’s how do I in the most strategic way connect my products and services with a prospect and a customer. And that gets down to a whole series of things like the competition in the marketplace, your products. But it also gets down to what’s your secret sauce, what makes you special, what makes you unique. Also gets down to your goals like the worst thing you can do is go build something you don’t really want to build if everything goes perfectly. And so I did really put myself through the wringer of trying to figure out what one thing what made Jim unique and so whether, I did coach Robin Sharma, I did coach Darren Hardy, Jim Rohn, and each one of those had a whole different strategy you know if someone me a question my typical answer is, it depends right. So how do you go become a speaker? It depends right. And so there are these series of questions so the wheel got down to this Rod how do you get people on the wheel and then take them around. And if the hub was Jim Rohn and each spoke was a product or service, and the big question was how do you get people on the wheel? That’s number one customer acquisition. Number two, I don’t like to hunt. I want to fish you know I want to figure out a way to get people to come to me now I got to put something out that’s authentically me and so for Jim Rohn, I don’t have one in front of me but I created this little quote book because Jim was the most profound wordsmith I’ve ever heard in my life and I knew people loved him. So I thought can I create something that this army of advocates will go out and give away and I ended up doing them for Zig Ziglar and Mark Victor Hansen and Brian Tracy and Denis Waitley but with Jim’s I moved six million the other I moved two million because Jim profoundly was the wordsmith. And of course that had my catalog that that turned out to be a multi-million dollar little viral guerrilla marketing tool. But it was birthed out of some questions that led me to create something that didn’t exist at the time you know there was no list of Jim Rohn quotes. I had to go through his seminars you know to the pull these out and I literally pulled out a thousand quotes. And got it
Rod: Yeah he’s known for his quotes for sure. What a brilliant idea and just let me. So guys, let me give you some context. Again, you’re going to need to create reach and to create reach you have to, and so if you don’t mind let’s drill down on this wheel a little more because you know again those are you listening going to start your multifamily business, you’re going to need to acquire contacts for you to stay in front of and create a list basically and that’s what we’re talking about here via this wheel process that Kyle created. So the first thing as he said is acquiring the contact. So maybe you can drill down little bit more on the wheel if you don’t mind?
Kyle: Sure. Yeah so again the big question for me was, how do I get people on the wheel? And then how do I take them around the wheel. And one of the best ways to do it is create a product or service that’s also customer acquisition. So when the internet came Rod I was one of the first guys to hit a million people. Now I sold my companies in 2007 so I don’t have that million plus email list but I you know early on, I didn’t try and sell, I try and get people on the wheel get them on my my email list through a variety of different things and then build a relationship with them you know the hardest group to sell to is a cold market. I want to sell to warm and hot like the things I do, pretty much 90% are referred by people already doing it right that’s what I want. I want to fish but I want the fish actually jumping in the boat. So it kind of gets back to, there’s a variety of aspects to this but one is principle based marketing. Principle based marketing is relationship driven. It’s starts with having a great product. Think of the people that go out with something that’s not that great and now they lose all the compounding effect. So you and I know every and this is true for your podcast, it’s true for everything you do, you put out great stuff, you’re consistent with it, your relational with it and now it has a compounding effect. So it’s got to begin with that when you look at what spoke. And then I’m just a big believer in having social proof and so on my website I’ll load it with social proof because that’s what makes me unique it’s back to the secret sauce. And we can come back to it but I got four key things everyone should have on their website when you go to it. And then the next thing is build an audience and then the next one after that’s taught to the audience. But when we say build an audience, it really again gets back to what makes you unique. Some people post on Facebook every day. Some people are wired that way some people have never done Facebook. I don’t advocate for doing you know what anyone else does. You got to do what works for you. But the simplest way for someone that says hey listen, I don’t really want to, well let me go back. So Jim Rohn there’s some early principles I learned from him. Can I share those real quick? Then we’ll jump back into the wheel
Rod: Yes please
Kyle: They tie into. So this was when I first started promoting him you know I learned through Jim that the major key to my better future was me right. It wasn’t anyone else so everything begins with us. So if you’re focused on the tactics but you’re not focused on yourself, growing yourself, growing your mind, you know right now there’s a lot of noise out there you know the government, the president, the economy and ultimately
Rod: COVID, Black Lives Matter, there’s a lot a lot of stuff happening right now for sure
Kyle: And so, a year from now you know things are gonna happen the way they happen but you and I, the things that are gonna have the greatest impact on us we get to control and that’s our thoughts, our attitude, what we read, what we listen to, what we give ourselves to our health, everything. And then he taught me that success is predictable. And that was powerful because he said, if you plant the seed, you’re gonna get the outcome. So it’s like, if you plant tomatoes over time you’re gonna get that result. Well that was powerful because I discovered something Rod that a lot of people that don’t really go pay the price, they try and skip ahead and you know these people right they’re trying to go
Rod: They want to take a pill you know they want I want to get rich quick and there is no get-rich-quick
Kyle: And ultimately, yeah that’s being sold. It’s being screamed people selling the dream and you know the key is if you really have faith, it’s like Jim Rohn somehow broke into my belief system that if I do the right things, I will get the result. And if someone truly believes that there is a roadmap to success, that people that have already achieved will teach you, that’s powerful right. So I bought into okay successes the series of things that if I do them, I will get the result. And then lastly though and this is where I’m going with this is he said, if you want to be successful learn to bring value to the marketplace. If you want to be wealthy, learn to bring value to valuable people. So that gets back to creating platforms and that’s one of the best ways to build an audience is to create a platform. You’ve done that with your podcast how much do you charge for people to listen to the podcast right?
Rod: Nothing. It’s free right
Kyle: But you’ve created a platform to bring on you’ve mentioned you’ve had billionaires, you’ve had these amazing people and that’s a platform you’ve created you know when someone does an event, they’re hosting the party. And as you and I know you sign you know a six-figure contract with the hotel that when things don’t go well you’re responsible and
Rod: Dealing with that right now with having to eliminate live events. I actually have a call today with a hotel in Dallas, hilarious you said that
Kyle: People don’t understand the risk and everything that’s involved when people that have platforms. But it also makes you valuable because guess what valuable people want? They want to find other valuable people like I just had Les Brown on one of my calls and like we said Darren Hardy you know was first podcast he said yes to in three years. He says no to all podcasts. But it’s because of the value I potentially bring and so when we talk about building an audience, it’s imperative you realize what your secret sauce is, what makes you special, and you begin with how do I bring value? And so, and then it’s just getting practical you know I really make it simple. I’ve had guys say I got a box of business cards. I don’t know what to do and I’m like well first of all, you have to have a methodology just to be able to put them on a list I recommend Aweber but whatever works and just occasionally talk to them. You don’t have to Pontificate, you don’t have to be the expert, you just can bring value. I call it being the utility, sharing cool things, you know just whatever creates that conversation like right now, if someone’s building the audience just reminding people if you have a business, you can pay your kids to do things. They can then put that in a Roth IRA and not pay tax on it and then use that as an investment vehicle. That’s just a reminder to tell your audience. So I’m always looking for things just to bring value and then
Rod: Can I interrupt for one second? I apologize you know it’s very interesting because I literally just had a call this morning with one of my warriors Ed, he wants to start building a brand and creating reach and literally just had this conversation an hour before our conversation and we went through all the different modality of vehicles, really put a podcast, a YouTube channel, a LinkedIn channel, a Facebook group, and he settled on a podcast. So I sent him a bunch of information that I do when people ask me about starting a podcast and we had the same conversation. There’s two keys here, one is consistency which we haven’t talked about but the other one well maybe you did kind of allude to it and but the other one is add value. You’ve got add value and I told him you know add value. Don’t think about selling anything or demanding anything or asking for anything, just add value and just one more point on that, you know when I first started this podcast, that was drilled into me as well by Tony actually said you know the people that add the most value in the world are the most successful. And so I used to do free phone calls with my listeners I say call me, we’ll set up a call 30 minutes we talk about anything I’m not gonna sell you anything and I did hundreds of them and just you know focused on adding value and it truly is a recipe for success. And I still do it the same thing I mean just as much value as we possibly can. So I just want to hammer home the value comment before you moved on to something else
Kyle: Thank you and again going back to the wheel, the number one thing is, there’s four criteria to creating a new spoke. Number one is, a part of your core business you know a lot of people go do outliers. Well now they’re dividing their energy is a part of your core business is it strategic? is it gonna knock down the dominoes? And I’m gonna tie that back in to what you just said hmm is it represent your secret sauce you know are you doing things that actually make you unique and stand out? I think I don’t want to copy anyone else because then I’m gonna attract people that aren’t really in alignment with me. The more authentic you can be about you you’ll attract all the right people and is it focused on the right avatar right we can all go do a lot of things but we want to focus on the right group. But here’s my point I’m always, you know when I’ve talked to multifamily syndicators and investors, a lot of times they’re spending a lot of time talking to potential investors and I always said well is there a way to flip that where people actually pay you to learn from you to then filter out who can be an investor. So that’s a model I’ve created multiple times well to get to there, you have to create a platform whether it’s an event or meetups
Rod: Meetup groups yeah
Kyle: But it begins with bringing value. You start bringing value so now you’re fishing versus hunting. Instead of 20 hours a week talking to people, you figure out how to get groups of people by bringing value and sometimes it’s also bringing in outside people
Rod: Sure and that’s a great way to start you fake it till you make it. If you’re the you know you’re the host, you bring in experts to either interview or to come to your Meetup. In fact, again just have this exact conversation so it’s kind of serendipity for me an hour ago and I forgot meetup and I told him this I mean you know he’s one of my students he’s new so you know he’s not an expert yet and I said don’t worry about it. Bring in experts yeah so well
Kyle: So true. I’ll do a post about Jim Rohn, my 18 year business partner people say well I can’t do that. I wished I could. And I’m like you actually can. You can do a post of a Jim Rohn book or a Jim Rohn quote and have a picture of Jim Rohn and say Jim Rohn changed my life you know when I first heard Jim Rohn, I was broke. After six years, now I have 200 apartment units. There’s ways to tie in your
Rod: Social proof yeah
Kyle: Social proof 100% I call that hooks. There’s, if I’m just telling my story who cares but if I mentioned Phil Collen to Def Leppard who’s the masterminds at my house and I worked with or if I mentioned Darren Hardy or Jim Rohn, afterwards people will come up and they’ll say I’m the biggest Def Leppard fan in the world or I’m the biggest Darren Hardy fan and so that’s what I call social proof is when you put out different things that might attract certain people right. And then the key is always having a way to get people to give you permission to talk to them. I give the example and this goes way back to even you know the nineties. I would not do an ad let’s say I’m doing a big event and it’s I’m advertising in the LA Times. I’m not gonna tell you when where or how much. Back before the internet you had to call me and after the internet you had to go to a link because my ultimate goal was not to sell you a ticket, my ultimate goal was to get you on my list because I had such confidence if I bring value and just keep bringing value and build relationships, then I’m gonna attract the right people you know I don’t go out and sell the dream. So I’m not worried about trying to get people that are gonna be here today and gone tomorrow, try and get them before they disappear. I’m just trying to build a relationship that eventually I can attract the right person for my deal. And then investing not everyone’s ready to spend 50,000 or spend a hundred thousand but you are bringing value and you don’t really worry about who gets on it you just bring value and at the right time good things will happen
Kyle: You know that’s common for you Rod. It’s common for me, the majority of my people I’ve had a relationship with a long time. Then finally the right thing happened and this is part of talking to a list you bring value and occasionally you give them something to say yes to right. And that could be
Rod: I’m sorry let me give some examples just because some concrete so they understand it. So for example guys you know I’ve got of course the podcast and I’m you know I’m consistent. I haven’t missed a week in three years and again so remember consistent and value. And then I’ve got a Facebook group with thirty four thousand members in it you know and tons of value in there I go live in there every week almost and then a YouTube channel with you know got watch for thirty thousand hours last year and because it’s adding value and so you know this is a recipe that works like a dream. And so and as nothing and you can absolutely do the same thing you just you know pick your vehicle as it were which is that is that how you recommend people start Kyle, is to pick the vehicle of choice as it relates to you know be at Facebook via LinkedIn, meetup group, YouTube whatever it is and then add value yes?
Kyle: Yes. I always say that everyone starts at zero. So one time Rod, you had zero podcast subscribers. So everyone starts at zero and you know they say when’s the best time to plant a tree well 20 years ago it’s like at best time is now. And so it really gets down to getting clear on what you want and once you know it’s like I said, success is predictable right, so decide what you want and then you’re gonna take a path. Don’t try and do everything at once like I go with what you know I feel led to do and what I feel connected to do. And I was talking to a couple that their investors, syndicators and you know he’s to spin off social media and he want to do a call about marketing and I’m like listen the best way right now to build a list is you got to be connected on social media. Now I’m not saying you got a post every day just go get involved. Post once a week but now you’re making yourself accessible for people to see you you know that you went to high school with or that are your neighbors. So there’s some simultaneous things you do but yeah go with what connects with you
Rod: And what you enjoy. That’s what I told the guy this morning. I said listen I don’t know if you enjoy writing if you enjoy doing videos. If you think you could host you know interview people if you think you could host a meet-up what do you think you do actually enjoy because that’s gonna you know when you enjoy it, it comes out and that you know I didn’t know that I’d like the podcast fact I didn’t think I would but I freaking love it and so the passion and comes out and by the way I’ve got massive rainstorm happening here so if you guys heard the background noise I apologize like a gully washer just waiting for a leak to spring but anyway but yeah it’s so important to you know pick up modality or a vehicle that you enjoy communicating in. And it’s so interesting you know as listening to you talk about your background yeah you know no college, same here and don’t like, not employable, don’t like jobs but I was also deathly afraid of speaking and info and wouldn’t even raise my hand in class and guys if that’s you, don’t worry there are vehicles you can use maybe you again you do a podcast you interview so you’re not pontificating you’re just asking questions. So anyway
Kyle: And Rod, I’m glad you said that because I got to where I’m at by doing the cold calling, going to speak at events. But then I remember putting on a massive event and I’m talking the 90’s and I’m trying to you know running an event’s not easy right? And the number, one of the hardest things number one is selling tickets. So and then number two you got to put it on and I didn’t have a very big team at the time. And then I remember just doing a horrific job of introducing Brian Tracy and I decided you know I’m gonna quit trying to do everything and then from that point on, I would put on huge events in film at Hollywood film crews and you don’t see me anywhere on it because I had a host and I had someone else doing it and I really made the decision. I’m gonna be the 100% behind-the-scenes guy which made me a lot of money but I got to tell you, I sold the companies. I came back out in 2014 and you and I both know, there is no place for a middle man. There is no place for publishers and record labels, you are the product and I can’t tell you how slow I walked myself up to being comfortable to speaking in front of groups. I would hold a mastermind and we would all be around the table and I never stood once. I was uncomfortable to stand
Rod: This is recent as well correct?
Kyle: Yeah the last five years. I did all the speaking but then once I stopped and I and again I’m inherently you know shy and timid and I prefer being behind the scenes and when I came back out in 2014 that’s why you know I said, Phil Calling to Def Leppard, I did these projects with everyone else Todd Stoudemire, baseball player you know and then I realized whatever reason the universe said, Kyle it’s your turn to come out and everything I did was someone else never if there was always a glitch but then when I started doing my mastermind and putting my message out, that’s when things worked and it was interesting but it was so uncomfortable and I have such a long-term perspective on doing that. It’s like I allow myself to be uncomfortable but not terrified. It’s like it’s like okay I am gonna inch my way into this
Rod: Okay what you just said is so important okay. Guys, that’s how you do it. You inch your way into it because I promise you, a lot of my listeners have some angst right now. They’re you know, how am I going to build relationships so that I can take advantage of the incredible opportunities that are coming as a result of this crisis you know within a you know eight months to a year and so how am I gonna build that reach? And again you do it a little bit at a time. I used to be horribly introverted and you know now I’ve done live events with thousands of people and so it’s just you build that that courage muscle a little again an inch at a time and that’s how you do it and so it’s interesting to hear that just as little as five years ago you know you had to kind indignant yourself
Kyle: Oh yeah Rod, if I had to get on the stage now. I’m still very nervous right yeah it’s uncomfortable for me. But let me address what you just said okay every time I speak I always say how many people have a hard time putting herself out there and you know we’re talking social media or whatever. Well everyone does that I know of. There’s a few that don’t. But I sold my companies and I so diminished my story I was almost embarrassed to go onto Facebook and say I was Jim Rohn’s 18 year business partner. And I didn’t dare say I created 300 lectural properties, built a million-plus list, sold millions, but I didn’t say any of that because I was afraid of being judged for being arrogant or offending the people I went to high school with and I played that game and then I realized you know eventually they’re gonna get offended anyway. And then I would occasionally step out and do a post from my heart and then people say I needed to hear that. And so there’s I think we might know Tom you might know Tom Burns, I don’t know. There’s a ton in my group yeah Colonel Tim Cole 31 year Colonel in the Marines, the guy set Mosely three-time Grammy winner and I would watch these guys really diminish their story. And so my question is and this is the defining question, is how much influence do you want to have? And that’s all it gets down to if you don’t want to have any influence just sit back and don’t do anything. But if you truly have the desire to have influence, you’re gonna have to get uncomfortable. You have to put yourself out there. And I’ll be honest, you will offend people
Rod: And you can’t be afraid of diminishing, you can’t be, you know it’s so common for people and I fell into this trap was I still do some where I’d appreciate myself yeah or I diminish and don’t want to you know put it out there and like you know I’ve got nice cars for example. And I and I rarely if ever show a picture of me with the Bentley anymore and or any of that because I just, so it’s the same thing. And guys, what he’s saying here is you have to get past that because I had to past the fact that I could make everybody happy and you know we get these haters on social media that are trolls that you know keyboard warriors that they say ugly things and you know that was really hard for me at first. And you’ve got to recognize that some people will not resonate with you. I do these sold-out live events and 99% of the people rave about them but there’s that one percent that you know didn’t like the mindset component, didn’t like the motivational piece, and you know and that’s always such a struggle but that’s the only way you’re going to succeed in building a list and adding value to a list is getting past all that and not self-depreciating, not you know and not being afraid to I mean you’ve become a master the social proof Kyle. I mean I can’t even count all the name
Kyle: And I’ll be honest Rod, I’d diminish my story I really do. I don’t know the degree week ago it’s unbelievable but it was over a long period of time but I diminished that story and I’m do a talk and I’ll you know Brian Tracy talks about us making millions together. And I’ll mention Brian tell some stories mentioned Jim and people come up and say so you’ve met Brian Tracy like they don’t even know or you knew Jim Rohn you know but I want to go back to the social proof one more time and just say that
Rod: Maybe could you give some suggestions for people in the multifamily space wanna you know connect with investors and utilize the strategy of social proof? Can you maybe I don’t know what if you could give some examples of what that might look like?
Kyle: Sure and I just want to say, what keeps us from sharing our story is actually our ego. There’s part of us that says oh I don’t want to go out and brag. No, you don’t want to go out and get judged. If you really want to have influence, you’re gonna have to put yourself out there and sometimes you’re gonna have to be verbose. Lady Gaga had to be verbose you know Madonna had to be verbose not all the time. But sometimes if I don’t tell my true story with Jim Rohn and Darren Hardy or Les Brown who ever it is, you’re not gonna know and then you’re not going to knock on my door and say hey, tell me more right. And people diminish their story because they don’t to be judged. And so it really is letting go of the ego and being willing to you know not worry about what other people think because you want the outcome right.
Kyle: So you know I talk about tactics versus principles. And tactics or technology-driven, so anything related to technology is gonna change the tactics so that could be Facebook, be LinkedIn, LinkedIn seems to be the hot thing right now to really target
Rod: Investors yeah I think that’s the demographic that’s in there and if you guys all know what the term avatar, if you don’t, an avatar is the type of customer you’re going after. So if it’s an investor, it’s you know an accredited investor with a certain income range and you know and you identify as many, well you document as many identifiers of this avatar, this person, we even name you know name the avatar and in and that’s the target that you’re going after in this case it would be an investor in my case you know with my coaching students I know it’s an analytical person typically 30 to 50 years old and you know I know all the details of this of my most common client. So anyway I just wanted to add a little bit please hope I didn’t derail you
Kyle: No not at all, I think it’s gonna be different with everyone but there’s some common principles. Number one, you’ve got to show up I know the people that I didn’t know who they were that now I know who they are .We have a relationships because they showed up at events, they showed up in private Facebook groups, they showed up with comments and liking my post, and that’s how you start building a relationship. And then you mentioned social proof so if you’re at an event with Rod, go take a picture with them. Post that. Don’t be afraid to but then give love you know if I post a picture with someone, I’m not sitting there saying hey you look at me with whoever right, Darren Hardy, I’m saying Darren Hardy’s an amazing guy you know 20-some plus your friend he did this he did this is you know go listen to his Darren Daily. So edify the person and that’s how you get over feeling like you are somehow taken advantage of that right. So again social proof is important. It works. It’s how we’re wired as human beings it’s also connects the dots. If I’m a big meal young fan or if I’m a big u2 fan and you mentioned them I’m gonna go really you’re I just saw them in concert right. Well it’s the same way if you post a picture with Rod or do a Jim Rohn quote you’re now gonna connect with the audience and just be really clever at connecting the dots. It’s the first principles go connect the dots so you have to like you said you got to take a step back and think about what’s important. The other thing is I don’t think people should just go all-in you know from zero to a hundred. Consistency is so important. So just getting a rhythm that works for you, the other thing Rod is in I don’t know how you feel about it but until you’re really really really big, do all that stuff yourself.
Rod: Yeah you can
Kyle: Yeah social media is about being social. And so the worst thing that can happen is people go hire a firm to go you know give sterols
Rod: Oh yeah you know its pictures that are bought on you know the photo websites you know that you can tell or professional pictures and you know it’s I remember doing my first videos, Kyle oh my god I look back on them and I’m horrified how bad they were but guys, don’t worry about having a professional video do it on your freakin iPhone. I mean in fact when I when I when we just had to pivot from my live event Orlando, we had to you know do a livestream event and you know I shot the video in my backyard with my iPhone because we literally had days to get the website up so we could pivot and innovate with this crisis that’s happened. In fact, if you let me interrupt for one second and put a little plug in, guys, if you are not one of the 900 people that paid to watch me a few weeks ago, we’ve got another event coming up July 25th and 26th two-day event drinking through a firehose, everything about this business, finding deals, evaluating deals, finding all the money you need for your deals, I spend a lot of time on what we’re talking about here with Kyle you know creating that brand and then building a list and picking a vehicle. I spend a lot of time on that there as well you know evaluating deals, doing the due diligence on deals, doing the financing for the deals, finding all the money you need for your deals and on and on and on it’s drinking through a fire hose for two days and it’s 97 freakin dollars. So listen if you haven’t done it’s July 25th and 26th, it’s multifamilyvirtualbootcamp.com or text rodlive to 41411 and I promise you, you would be glad you spent two days with me. Anyway thank you for allowing me to put the plug in there and having a little bit of you know segway for it
Kyle: Yeah I’m enjoying the virtual. I mean we, in my world we do a lot of events with my inner circle and we just had to do a two-day virtual and I had a memory and marketing event I do with my longtime friend Tom Memory Champion and we had a hotel in Philadelphia and we kept trying to push it out and moved it from April to August and I’m like you know who even knows the hotels on furlough. So we moved it to a virtual event and oh my goodness it was just so much, again a lot more people got to attend right. They didn’t have to get on the airplane. They didn’t have to buy a hotel they you know we get to record it. They get to go back and watch it we travel interaction throughout
Rod: Ours was a huge success too. I mean huge success. I’m blown away by how successful it was and I will tell you was hard though it was hard for me because you know instead of hundreds of people giving me love and clapping and smiling and giving me energy. I have my stone-faced boat videographer and luckily my daughter was there for a little bit of it but with social distancing I couldn’t have known a couple people there but oh huge success. So yeah but it’s you know I will tell you thankfully we my whole company’s been virtual for a couple of years now. So it wasn’t a huge shift I had to build a video studio here in one of the buildings in my compound but other than that, but I think it’s a new normal buddy. I don’t know what you think Kyle but I think we’re gonna do be doing a lot more of this
Kyle: Oh yeah it’s good it’s gonna take a while to go back because there’s so much risk to put on an event as we’re watching like again hotels give you a 10-day force dujour but
Rod: Yeah that’s a clause in the contract which I again, I’m gonna be talking about this afternoon with a hotel in Dallas is force majeure where you can’t do an event because of natural disasters like that pandemic
Kyle: But it’s only ten days. So if the 9-11 event happens, no one’s flying out to Dallas for your event and that’s decided long before. And so right now I was talking with someone yesterday that has an event in August. I’m like go virtual and they were like well we want to do both and I’m like well, and they’re in Pennsylvania and I’m like well I think it’s visually more attractive to do it on Zoom than it is to try and film it with the film crew. And there are ways I know we just really made it interactive. We had the gallery views and I was looking at the gallery views on the monitor. So I did see the love right.
Rod: Yeah I got some of that too. I did get some of that but you know
Kyle: I mean, who’s gonna put on a concert what concert promoter is gonna say I’m gonna take all the risk and realize we’re in a vulnerable place we’re
Rod: We’re supposed to have 800 people in Dallas in August, horrible time to be in Dallas but just the way it worked out but how do we get, if there’s social distancing we can maybe get two hundred and two hundred fifty people in a room for eight hundred so you know it’s just not gonna work until this vaccine comes out or whatever so
Kyle: And I don’t even trust the hotels to I mean they’re so vulnerable right now too you know everyone’s furlough. So it’s the new normal for a while yeah and it’s just a lot of risk to try and put on an event
Rod: Right talk about your 52 lessons and talk about that and guys I’m gonna highly recommend you get this it’s a free thing that that Kyle puts out and it’s on his website KyleWilson.com but talk about the value there because it sounds like an incredible value
Kyle: Well can I share a couple?
Rod: Yeah yeah please
Kyle: Yeah you know being a seminar, I’ve been doing this for thirty years so I have like Les Brown was just on my podcast and one of my Les Brown stories is 1994 Gladys Knight Billy Preston in him and us going out to dinner and then us doing motivation and music events with Billy Preston and it’s the story of Les being a DJ and it’s one of my favorite Les Brown stories. Brian Tracy, I remember being at his house 1990. I’m a young promoter and he said Kyle, I encourage you to pay the price for the next couple of years. He sits like in a plane off the ground you know a plane you can go 80 miles an hour down the runway burn tons of fuel or you can be 300-400 miles up in jetstream burning less fuel than 80 miles an hour in the runway and he said most people spend their whole life on the runway because they never pay the price to get the plane off the ground. It takes that extra effort. And I really took that to heart. Zig Ziglar saying, never do a good deal with a bad guy. Rod, I’ve never sued anyone. I’ve never been sued which is hard to believe. Now I’ve been sued because of some of my people did something right, and I wrote the check but how do you do that? Well part of it is you just look for red flags quick if someone’s litigious no thank you
Rod: You trust your gut too. Your brain is, it’s you know it can detect micro signals subconsciously that you don’t detect consciously and if something doesn’t feel right you know you guys have heard me talk about developing partnership and how I have a free resource of all the questions you should ask before you get into a partnership that I give out. In fact, let me go ahead and I’ll give you the though the thing for it here if I have it I don’t have it right here, oh here it is if you’re gonna get into a partnership it’s got 50 questions to text partnership to 41411 and it’s all the questions you should ask but the first thing you’ve got to do is trust your gut. If it doesn’t feel right trust it because I can tell you every time I haven’t, I’ve regretted it. I don’t know if that ties into what you’re saying here because
Kyle: It does yeah I think it’s one of the most valuable lessons for this audience is don’t do a good deal at the bad guy you know sometimes were desperate to make a deal happen but there’s sharks out there whose whole goal is to take what’s yours and make it theirs. So do the due diligence on the person and that’s huge and it has saved me and how do I know this because it cost me early on too right and you kind of look for those common threads. I almost you put a little test out and you try and see what someone’s philosophy is. Are they a giver or they a taker? Are they win-win or win-lose? like the things right and
Rod: You know I’ve got a mastermind myself and you know as you know that’s an incredible environment and I think with the one person we just added were over ten billion in assets represented by that mastermind but I’ve turned lots of people away because I look for that that dynamic right there because it’s a place to give not just get. And so if they’re narcissistic and it’s all about take take get get they’re not they’re not the right fit for that group so
Kyle: Yeah it’s really tricky like I always say mine’s not pricey but it’s exclusive because I’m looking for the right combo and here’s one of the things I look for Rod, I’m also looking for the person that just doesn’t come to give like you have some pretty big people that have big platforms but they’re taking notes. They’re sitting there. They’re not just coming to be the expert. They’re there are some people massively successful that wouldn’t be a good fit because they’re not going to come to learn. They’re gonna come to export and so that’s always interesting too but I’ll share a couple more lessons but short you know the Khleif note version. Denis Waitley, early on we were talking and he said Kyle, I’ve written 18 number one best-selling books and he said but I’m a full-time speaker. I traveled the world. So I’ve written them all over a period of 30 years at night. He said during primetime TV for most people is prime time for building my business. And he you know he basically summed it up as prime time’s the right time to build your business and I think that’s true for all of us. You have your day job you have your thing you make a living and in this prime time when other people are watching TV that you got to go build that second thing and there is a power and I think in keeping your day job for a lot of reasons. It’s also part of your influence right like if I’m talking to someone about you know investments, it’s like who’s your influence? like there’s a guy I know who world-class at what he did in the tech world we’ll you know he got out he retired he became a full-time investor. Now he’s competing against everyone else trying to raise money and I said you know again what’s your secret sauce? What makes you valuable? Now he’s back in the tech world doing consulting making a lot of money having a lot of fun traveling the world but that’s where his investors are coming from.
Rod: And I’ll add something else you know and I get this question all the time should I quit my job and do multifamily full-time? And my answer is always no. Not just because the reasons you just mentioned which are which are very very valid and important but also if you don’t have income, you’re gonna get caught up in fear and we all know fear paralyzes. And if you’re paralyzed, you’re not gonna take action on multi-family.
Kyle: Definitely the number one reason, income’s the number one reason to not do it and I get. I mean there’s a thousand variables but all things being even, if you’re able to keep your day job and go build something and again it’s back to, you can’t make a vineyard in two months. No matter what course you take or who told you what it’s gonna take five years and I had a vineyard at one time and it takes five years and so if someone really again success is predictable but they’re not buying into the get-rich-quick. They’re not gonna be forced to go do a bad deal just to get the promotion money and on the front end you know they’re not going to be desperate to do deals they shouldn’t do right. It’s gonna help them do all the right things
Rod: Yeah no that’s absolutely accurate and back to your prime time example and I’ve got a sign on my wall right here I can show you it says you know, “Focus Grind Now Play Later”. And that’s really the bottom line is you’ve got to be willing to make short-term sacrifices and work like other people won’t for a few years to live like other people can’t the rest of your life. And so you know absolutely. One more give us one more
Kyle: Jim Rohn, I met Jim when he was 59 he died at age 79 and I can tell you confidently the biggest impact he had was from 59 to 79. Zig Ziglar was in his 50s there’s a lot you know if people are in their 40s or 50s and they think oh I’m behind no you’re okay you’re okay. It takes time and his whole thing is the two biggest challenges to success are greed and basically impatience right. And so when we’re impatient or greedy, those are the two biggest things will take us off track. So you just have to realize it’s gonna take time. Don’t go for the fear of loss. Don’t go for the get rich quick don’t do a good deal with the bad guy. And it’s anything great is gonna take time there’s a few exceptions to everything. Don’t pay attention to the few except you know there’s outliers you know some occasionally someone hits the lottery or the hell Mary pass does work
Rod: Yeah so guys don’t talk to me about the lottery. Come on, I mean that’s for fun but as a strategy come on
Kyle: And I’m saying in business. In business, they’re going for the lottery
Rod: No, agreed agreed you know that too, going for the quick hit for the IPO that’s gonna make them overnight millionaires
Kyle: And here’s what’s cool, there is a stair-step to success that’s guaranteed and I think I, this is just observation, a lot of times when people have the wrong philosophy or they are a bit of a taker or they do have a win-lose, a lot of times and you’ll encounter like that’s a good guy why the heck and it’s just this lack of faith and understanding if you sow a seed, you’re gonna get you know a result and Jim Rohn was so core about philosophy. What you sow is what you’re gonna get so focus on what you want three years from now five years from now and go plant those seeds and that’s a guaranteed success versus all the you know the people selling the dream and here’s what I take exception to Rod. It’s not the money people have paid to go buy the dream, it’s the additional hundred thousand it cost them by going down the wrong road. And I have seen that in my own road
Rod: By the mistakes they’ve made. Ask me how I know. I’ve a t-shirts now that I handouts they ask me how I know because I’ve made every freaking mistake. So Kyle if you don’t mind, let’s get a little bit strategic for a moment and talk about some strategies for building a list and on I can give some of the examples that I’ve used but I’d love to hear your take on actually getting people on the top of the funnel as it were for lack of a better way to describe it. Can you speak to that a little bit?
Kyle: Yeah let me begin with just the most practical you know for people that have full-time jobs. They’re not doing online marketing. Let me just begin at a very grassroots practical way. If I’m at an event, and I meet someone there’s no way I’m not gonna at some point in time say would they like my 52 lessons and how it typically works as they come up and they ask if I have a business card. Well I don’t and I’m like do you have a business card and then when they give it to me I ask if I can add them to my 52 lessons. It’s free and no one ever says no. Now, if they don’t have a business card, on my phone I just haven’t put in their name and email. Again I mean I’m on an airplane coming back on the red-eye from Los Angeles three years ago. I’m sitting by lady we don’t say a word. But at the very end we start talking and she says what’d he do and I ended up giving her one of the books that I do that has a lot of celebrity authorities I had some big people in it and she gave me her card and she just signed up recently for something. And again it’s the fishing I just put some good stuff out. So to start collecting you know if you have business cards, if you’re at events, if you’re you know go were we talked about your avatar go to events that have the avatar of people you want. Now go to investor events right and meet those people. But then go other places so being out in the marketplace meeting people. Obviously if you’re a guest on a podcast, obviously if you go speak doing articles and blogs. But I still you know I sold my companies I had a million-plus list. When I started over Rod, I had nothing because I sold my million-plus list, every intellectual property, I was number one on Google and probably a hundred areas with different content that was all gone. So I started at zero and I realized the quickest fastest way is social media. That’s where you’re gonna reach the most people. Now I didn’t go overboard I did it at my pace at my style but so much of my business has come from social media. So you gotta get on social media but then you can’t just go broadcast, you have to connect right. And then find the groups and I would just say really just take your time. Now if you’re more advanced and you’re doing everything we just said obviously a podcast or a YouTube channel, Facebook lives are really powerful. And if again if you’re at an event you’re talking to someone that has value to add to your audience to say hey can we do a quick 60 second Facebook live. But everything’s just gonna take time it’s not, there is no quick fix. There are outliers of a quick fix but usually here’s one of the challenges. We see what someone else is doing and we’re like oh man they’re all over the place. They’re doing all this stuff. It doesn’t mean it’s working necessarily right. I’ve had that in my industry where people go create a product or scrap their plan to do someone else’s plan. And I knew that plan destroy their company. I can give you examples of horrible ideas that have been duplicated
Rod: And the other side of this is, don’t think you’ve got to have 50,000 people either. You get a few hundred that that you’ve really connected with you’ve really got something okay and don’t minimize that. Now one of the things I do I’ll mention is I create really incredible content okay and I’m sure you hear you guys can’t see this on iTunes but I’ve got one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight books that I’ve written that I give away for free. And they’re not fluffy crap pieces. By the way guys, you produce crap, you are crap. So you’ve got to put real educational I heard that from somebody else I stole that but you’ve got to put real quality stuff out if you do that that’s another way to get people into your list like Kyle’s 52 lessons. That’s exactly along the same lines you know once you take a look at that and get it you’ll be in his you’ll be in his ecosystem
Kyle: And let me give you a secret on that Rod. The secret was I figured out what would my potential avatar want, what my avatar, Jim Rohn fans right. I’m the guy right I have the story no one else has. So I thought okay that’s my avatar. Well, I’m gonna create this but not everyone’s a Jim Rohn fan some are Darren Hardy and Denis Waitley. But then I started, all I had to do was create a page create a offer and then I wrote one less than a week for 52 weeks. You don’t always have to go create it all you can grab with the eight-week course or a four point thing and all you have to do is create the front end offer and then the
Rod: And then you can do it as you go as time goes on you add, continue to add value absolutely absolutely
Kyle: And just be careful on Facebook and Instagram you’re not trying to buy likes because there are a lot of challenge and I’d rather sell a product to get the email upfront than trying to go buy likes because Facebook a great example is and you know this but we don’t own our podcast list. We don’t own our Facebook list. I remember Tom Ziegler good friend of mine they had five million people on Zig and he would get a 150,000-200,000 likes per post. I’m like, Tom you got to get them off not keep them on Facebook but you got to get him on an email list told Robert rests the same thing with the real estate guys back in 2012. You got this great podcast but you have to have a way to talk to them and your email list is really the only thing that yours you know if you are
Rod: Or phone numbers or phone numbers if you have them text for something which is one thing we do but yeah I will tell you like in our big Facebook group and we I didn’t get this memo to way until we had 30,000 people but now if they come on we request their email address.
Kyle: Of course
Rod: And so you know that’s how you create this. Listen, again guys you don’t need 30,000. You get three or four or five hundred I mean there’s a book I think about having a thousand great contacts and you can become a multi-millionaire with a thousand great contacts. I forgot the name of the book
Kyle: Okay so Rod, let me play off that a little bit so here’s just a little technique two little quick techniques, if you are on a podcast or if you’re being interviewed I have some people in my world that have been part of this book thing I’m doing where I interview everyone and they send people to a website to get all this free stuff and I’m like, well maybe just tell people to send you an email and then you’ll send them the links to all the free stuff same thing you know if you’re a speaker. There’s an athlete Keith Elias who would speak and people come up afterwards saying that’s amazing I want to hire you to speak give me your card. He’d give him a card, he’d never here from them. So you can take control of the conversation by getting the email and then you can follow up. So getting the email’s more important than getting someone to your website that might or might not. Now on this I’m not giving my email that’s not you know I’m just saying if someone’s in the beginning right, that’s one of the best ways to create that list
Rod: Yeah absolutely and you know so you’ve got to pick the vehicle that you like that you think you’d enjoy being consistent in. Figure out how to add value and build that list and then you’ve really have something valuable.
Kyle: And here’s the key. It all gets back to fundamentals and basics like we said in the beginning. And a lot of people they want to build branding. They want to build a story. But PR and branding at the end of the day without a list gets you very little. So it’s all about building a list so you have to be intentional about the wheel. hey have to get on the wheel before you can take them around. And that really is an email. So think of Facebook, think of interviews, think of events, think of wherever you go, getting the email. So now you can have and some people get the email but then they got to have a place to put it so this is just the practical stuff. Go get Aweber and add them to there’s more
Rod: There’s multiple CRMs you can use. We HubSpot. I’ve used Infusionsoft. There’s an app Podio. You know Zoho, Insightly, Really simple systems. Lots of CRM. Aweber is definitely a good one too you know but
Kyle: It’s not the CRM, it’s just the email list
Rod: Oh email provider okay. So it’s how you send the emails sure okay and then you’ve got to be consistent that’s the key thing. Well listen guys, Kyle, I really appreciate you your being on the show today. You’ve added tremendous value guys. Go to his website KyleWilson.com and get his 52 lessons and you know we’re definitely gonna have to have you back on because I think like you for another two hours on this topic which I freaking love. But thank you and it’s been such a pleasure meet you my friend
Kyle: Rod, thank you so much. So honored to be on your show talking to your audience appreciate you my friend
Rod: Thank You
Ads: Rod, I know a lot of our listeners are wanting to take their multifamily investing business to the next level. I know you’ve been hard at work helping our warrior students do just that using our ACT methodology which is Awareness, Close, and Transform. Can you explain to the listeners how they can get our help? You bet. Guys, we’ve been going nonstop for three years building an amazing community of like-minded people and our coaching students which we call our warriors have had extraordinary results. They’ve purchased thousands and thousands of units and last year we did over a thousand units with our students. And we’re looking to grow this group and take it to the next level. We’re looking for people who want to follow a proven framework that’s really step by step and then leverage our systems and network to raise equity, to find and close deals, and to build partnerships nationwide. Now our warrior community is finding success in any market cycle. So if you’re interested in finding out more about how you can become more of our incredible network and take advantage of the incredible opportunities that are coming very soon, apply to work with us at mentorwithrod.com or text “crush” to 41411. That’s mentorwithrod.com or text “crush” to 41411.