Manufactured Housing Investing with Ali Nassir
Manufactured housing investing has become one of the most resilient real estate strategies in today’s market, and few investors understand the asset class better than Ali Nassir. As a second-generation manufactured housing operator with decades of experience, Ali has participated in thousands of mobile home and manufactured housing units while navigating multiple economic cycles, interest rate environments, and market disruptions. In this conversation, he shares why manufactured housing communities continue to outperform many traditional real estate sectors and why affordable housing remains one of the strongest long-term investment themes.
Why Manufactured Housing Investing Continues to Thrive
Ali explains that manufactured housing communities occupy a unique position within the real estate industry because they provide one of the most affordable paths to homeownership. As housing costs continue to rise across the country, demand for affordable housing solutions remains strong. This creates a compelling opportunity for investors who understand how to identify, acquire, and improve manufactured housing communities.
One of the biggest advantages discussed is tenant retention. Unlike apartment renters who can easily move to another building, manufactured housing residents often own their homes and lease only the land beneath them. Since moving a manufactured home can be expensive and impractical, residents tend to stay much longer, creating stable occupancy and predictable cash flow for owners.
The Best Business Model for Manufactured Housing Communities
A major topic of discussion is the difference between owning rental homes versus operating a lot-rent model. Ali emphasizes that the most attractive manufactured housing investments typically focus on lot rent, where residents own their homes and the community owner rents the land.
This approach offers several advantages:
- Reduced maintenance responsibilities
- Greater resident pride of ownership
- Lower operating expenses
- Stronger long-term retention
- More scalable management
Ali also explains how experienced operators create additional profit centers within their communities. These can include home sales, seller financing programs, note income, and vertically integrated management systems that improve overall returns while creating more value for residents.
Finding Deals in a Competitive Market
Although manufactured housing investing has become increasingly popular, Ali believes strong opportunities still exist for investors willing to focus on distressed assets and off-market acquisitions. Drawing from his background in business turnarounds and distressed investments, he discusses the importance of identifying underperforming communities where operational improvements can unlock significant value.
His preferred acquisition criteria often focus on secondary markets and communities large enough to support professional management. While competition has increased, he notes that life events such as retirement, estate transitions, and ownership fatigue continue to create opportunities for investors who maintain strong relationships and local market expertise.
Economic Trends, Inflation, and Real Estate Opportunities
The conversation also explores broader economic trends affecting investors today. Ali and Rod discuss inflation, rising costs, interest rates, and the growing influence of artificial intelligence on the workforce. While many professionals are concerned about job disruption, both emphasize the importance of owning hard assets that can provide income and inflation protection.
Manufactured housing investing stands out because affordable housing demand tends to remain strong regardless of economic conditions. As consumers face higher living costs, affordable housing options often become even more attractive, positioning manufactured housing communities as a potentially recession-resistant asset class.
The discussion highlights the importance of maintaining a long-term perspective, understanding demographic trends, and staying adaptable as economic conditions evolve. Investors who focus on fundamentals, cash flow, and real assets may be better positioned to capitalize on future opportunities.
About Ali Nassir
Ali Nassir is the Managing Partner of RISE 360 and a second-generation manufactured housing investor. His family has been involved in the manufactured housing industry since 1981, and throughout his career he has participated in thousands of manufactured housing units while also investing in distressed businesses and commercial real estate opportunities. His expertise spans acquisitions, underwriting, operations, asset management, and value-add strategies within the manufactured housing sector.
If you want to hear the full conversation and detailed insights, watch the podcast video or read the complete transcript below.
Manufactured Housing Investing FAQ
What Is Manufactured Housing Investing?
Manufactured housing investing is a real estate investment strategy focused on acquiring, operating, and improving manufactured housing communities or mobile home parks. Investors generate income through lot rent, home sales, seller financing, and value add improvements while providing affordable housing options to residents.
Why Is Manufactured Housing Investing Popular?
Manufactured housing investing is popular because it offers strong cash flow, lower operating expenses compared to many other asset classes, and high demand for affordable housing. The sector has gained attention from investors seeking recession resistant real estate investments and long term wealth creation.
How Does Manufactured Housing Investing Work?
Manufactured housing investing typically involves purchasing a manufactured housing community and collecting rent from residents who lease the land beneath their homes. Some investors also generate additional revenue through home sales, financing programs, utility reimbursements, and community improvements.
What Are the Benefits of Manufactured Housing Investing?
Manufactured housing investing offers several advantages, including stable occupancy, strong resident retention, affordable housing demand, scalable operations, and multiple revenue streams. Many investors also appreciate the lower maintenance burden when residents own their homes and rent only the lot.
What Is the Difference Between a Manufactured Housing Community and a Mobile Home Park?
The terms are often used interchangeably, but manufactured housing community is the modern industry term. Mobile homes generally refer to homes built before 1976, while manufactured homes are built according to federal construction standards established by the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development.
Why Do Investors Prefer Lot Rent Communities?
Many investors prefer lot rent communities because residents own their homes while leasing the land. This model reduces maintenance responsibilities, encourages pride of ownership, lowers operating costs, and often results in longer resident stays compared to traditional rental properties.
How Do Investors Make Money in Manufactured Housing Investing?
Investors can generate income through monthly lot rent, home sales, seller financed notes, utility income, and property appreciation. As occupancy increases and operating performance improves, the overall value of the community can rise significantly.
Is Manufactured Housing Investing Recession Resistant?
Manufactured housing investing is often considered one of the more recession resistant real estate sectors because it provides affordable housing. During economic downturns, demand for lower cost housing options may increase as consumers seek more affordable living arrangements.
What Should Investors Look for When Buying a Manufactured Housing Community?
Investors typically evaluate occupancy rates, lot count, market demand, infrastructure condition, utility systems, rent growth potential, and management efficiency. Strong locations with opportunities for operational improvements often present the best value add opportunities.
How Many Lots Should a Manufactured Housing Community Have?
While smaller communities can be profitable, many experienced investors prefer communities with at least 50 to 100 lots. Larger communities often provide better economies of scale, support on site management, and create more operational efficiency.
Can Manufactured Housing Communities Increase in Value?
Yes. Manufactured housing communities are commonly valued based on their net operating income. As investors increase occupancy, improve operations, and grow revenue, the property’s value can increase substantially.
Is Manufactured Housing Investing a Good Long Term Strategy?
Many investors view manufactured housing investing as a strong long term strategy due to the ongoing need for affordable housing, limited new community development, high resident retention, and the potential for consistent cash flow and appreciation over time.
00:00:24:27 – 00:00:43:10
Rod Khleif
Welcome back to lifetime cash flow through real estate investing. I’m Rod Khleif, and I’m thrilled you’re here. And I know you’re going to get tremendous value from the gentleman I’m interviewing. Today’s name is Ali Nasser and he’s the managing partner of rice. 360 rice 360 is manufactured housing. We won’t call them trailer parks. They’re manufactured housing. We’re going to have a lot of fun today.
00:00:43:10 – 00:01:05:13
Rod Khleif
It’s an asset class. Absolutely love. So we’re going to dig into it. But his signature is cigars. Now he typically smokes a cigar when he does an interview. And so and he didn’t bring his match with him or matches with him. And so I brought a tool that I like to use when I’m lighting my fireplace, because I think it’s, you know, the difference between men and boys is the price of their toys.
00:01:05:13 – 00:01:07:10
Rod Khleif
Right. So I’ve got your lighter here.
00:01:07:11 – 00:01:12:16
Ali Nassir
Oh my gosh. Wow, that would work. You couldn’t see it.
00:01:12:17 – 00:01:21:01
Rod Khleif
If you’re just listening. But it’s a freaking torch that it’s almost like a flame thrower. But anyway, that was a joke. I brought a smaller one to that. That won’t be quite as.
00:01:21:01 – 00:01:30:07
Ali Nassir
Dangerous as well. You know, I might want to use the big one. All right, give it a try. Give it a try. Just be careful. We actually use torches, but nothing of this size. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now, what am I doing to. I just push.
00:01:30:07 – 00:01:31:21
Rod Khleif
That button kind of hard.
00:01:31:29 – 00:01:33:23
Ali Nassir
Oh, yeah? Yeah, like, click.
00:01:33:23 – 00:01:34:21
Rod Khleif
It hard. There you go.
00:01:34:23 – 00:01:41:09
Ali Nassir
There you go. Yeah. Let’s get this baby lit up. This is a league of provider number nine. Okay? Okay.
00:01:41:14 – 00:01:52:10
Rod Khleif
So his signature is is smoking cigars. In his interviews, he asked to smoke if he could smoke in here, which has never happened in here, but. Wow. I think that’s pretty well lit.
00:01:52:11 – 00:02:00:25
Ali Nassir
Yeah. Thank you for letting me do this here. I do appreciate it. Yeah. Amazing torch. Yeah. Right. And I’m gonna have to like, I love I love stupid.
00:02:00:25 – 00:02:17:17
Rod Khleif
Shit like that, but, Well, welcome to show brother. So this is your signature. I told you my signature, which I become known for, is, you know, black jeans and flip flops. I teach thousands of people a year that way. Not because I’m trying to be coolest. Because my feet hurt. You know, I did my first interview. I’m sorry.
00:02:17:18 – 00:02:33:00
Rod Khleif
My first boot camp in in a in a suit. And I wore tight black shoes. And you’re comfortable. You got sneakers on. You’re comfortable today, too. But I was freaking miserable. Yes, my first one. I’m like, screw this, I don’t want to do it. And then I thought, you know what? Why not just do it comfortable? Just do what I want.
00:02:33:02 – 00:02:39:27
Rod Khleif
Where would I want? And I loved it, and people didn’t care. So, you know, you know, it’s great when you become more and more free from the opinion of others.
00:02:39:29 – 00:02:44:26
Ali Nassir
That’s it, that’s it. You know, I was a bow tie and suspenders kind of guy for many, many years.
00:02:44:28 – 00:02:45:14
Rod Khleif
Bow ties.
00:02:45:16 – 00:02:49:04
Ali Nassir
Wow. On every day, even if I didn’t have an event or that was.
00:02:49:11 – 00:02:52:00
Rod Khleif
Where did you come from? What did you do? Prior to mobile home parks.
00:02:52:00 – 00:03:03:01
Ali Nassir
So I’m second generation in parks. I’ve done this all my life, okay. But concurrently or simultaneously. I was kind of, you know, my father, much like, I think maybe a similar story. Immigrant story.
00:03:03:02 – 00:03:03:28
Rod Khleif
I’m an immigrant. Yeah.
00:03:04:00 – 00:03:23:04
Ali Nassir
Yeah. To you and yours with your mother. You know, he said early on. And he’s an amazing man. He’s got, bless him. He’s, you know, he said, hey, I’m, I’m going to teach you how to fish. I’m not going to give you fish. Good. So, so, so, as a family, we worked in the family business, which was mobile home parks.
00:03:23:05 – 00:03:30:12
Ali Nassir
No kidding. And we all had to contribute, and I was really fond of it. I was just a sponge around this guy who was like a 1 in 1,000,000,000. Not because.
00:03:30:13 – 00:03:31:13
Rod Khleif
Is he still with us or. Oh.
00:03:31:13 – 00:03:46:25
Ali Nassir
Yeah, okay. But not because of not. You know, I joke all the time Indian population is a billion plus from India, right? Right. And I’m South Asian and Indian Pakistani. And so, you know, he’s not one in a building just because of the population size. He’s 1 in 1,000,000,000 because he’s a surreal entrepreneur. You know, serial entrepreneur. Excuse me.
00:03:46:25 – 00:04:01:23
Ali Nassir
Love it. And when he said he’s not going to give me fish, basically that meant that I to answer your question, that meant that at 17, I started venturing out in business on my own. So I’ve done a number of things, but the common theme has been rod distressed assets.
00:04:01:24 – 00:04:05:28
Rod Khleif
Real estate. So you’ve done other real estate asset classes in your in your journey here?
00:04:06:05 – 00:04:12:02
Ali Nassir
Yes, absolutely. Other real estate asset classes but also distressed assets in general. So going concerns Main Street businesses.
00:04:12:03 – 00:04:13:12
Rod Khleif
Oh you bought businesses as well.
00:04:13:13 – 00:04:27:11
Ali Nassir
Absolutely. So I took the the M&A model or even a VC model of throwing, you know, ten deals up in the air, knowing that one’s going to be a grand slam. Or maybe you get a couple of home runs and they’re not all going to make it because they’re distressed.
00:04:27:11 – 00:04:34:03
Rod Khleif
So did you did you do roll ups or did you do multiple multiple in the same asset class? Or when you said, do you throw a bunch in the air? I was just curious.
00:04:34:03 – 00:04:51:10
Ali Nassir
I did I did a multiple a bunch of different Main Street type of businesses over the years, and I had a central management team, okay, CTO, CFO, myself as a general manager or CEO and whatnot, and we would basically contract ourselves out to these distressed businesses, get them stabilized and flip them.
00:04:51:12 – 00:05:11:13
Rod Khleif
Interesting. So you stepped in without actually putting any cash in and just help stabilize them. Got a piece of the upside and sold them. Right. Oh, what an interesting model. That’s right. What was your just we’re kind of digressing here a little bit. Sure. But but I’m interested in buying businesses. I think there’s an incredible opportunity. There’s 10,000 people a day turning 65 in this country, and they want to retire.
00:05:11:13 – 00:05:30:11
Rod Khleif
And a lot of them own businesses. There’s 10,000 people a day, 9 or 10,000 turning 80. In this country. I’m very into senior housing. I’ve got six unit six, six assisted living facilities under contract right now in Texas. Screaming deal. But but anyway. But that’s about you not me. But anyway. So so what businesses did you like the most.
00:05:30:13 – 00:05:38:15
Rod Khleif
You know you see the most promising. Now when you answer, keep in mind what AI is going to do to eliminate some of these businesses. So I’m just curious what your thoughts on.
00:05:38:16 – 00:05:58:05
Ali Nassir
Well, you know, the reality. I mean, things may have changed, but at least in my experience back in the day, and I don’t do that anymore. I happen to be very fond of transportation logistics oriented businesses because I understood I was fascinated just by optimizing truckloads or not loads, but any any vehicles.
00:05:58:06 – 00:05:59:29
Rod Khleif
So trucking companies and things of that nature.
00:06:00:00 – 00:06:15:24
Ali Nassir
I shouldn’t say that exactly. I misled you like the truckload model, the concept of of, you know, the idea of a truck coming back empty with any vehicle coming back empty frustrated me, and I wanted to see how we could leverage that because that’s what happens. Most of the time.
00:06:15:26 – 00:06:16:07
Rod Khleif
Same with.
00:06:16:07 – 00:06:28:09
Ali Nassir
Ships, with ships, with Ubers, with anything. Right. With Fedex trucks and whatnot. And so I got into really I ended up doing more courier limo, black car, that kind of business more than anything else.
00:06:28:10 – 00:06:28:25
Rod Khleif
Interesting.
00:06:28:25 – 00:06:47:29
Ali Nassir
But but I’ve done HVAC, I’ve done a flower shop, I’ve done a coffee shop. And this is really not to digress, because the main well, that was kind of I had two worlds, rod. Okay, that the mobile home park business we’ve been in as a family, like I said, I’m second generation, so since 1981. Wow. And so that’s always been steady and constant.
00:06:47:29 – 00:07:19:17
Ali Nassir
And the reason I’m so focused on that even today is that experience in doing M&A deals, doing distressed deals of Main Street businesses and of other commercial real estate classes only solidified only further reinforced evidence to me of why this asset class and I challenge. With all due respect, I would challenge you or anybody in a debate about why this asset class mobile home park stands in a unique category of its own, unlike any other.
00:07:19:18 – 00:07:42:16
Rod Khleif
I don’t disagree with you. Actually, I don’t disagree with you at all. It’s a fantastic asset class. Now, that said, you know, a lot of people know that a lot of people are in it. It’s much, much harder to find deals than it was 8 or 9 years ago. Sure. You know, in fact, I don’t know if you know this, but I actually had six virtual assistants logging every mobile home park in the whole country, state by state.
00:07:42:16 – 00:07:54:16
Rod Khleif
And we actually had them. A lot of them are misclassified in the public record. So I’d have them fly around on Google Earth if they see one, look around, see those others around it, geocode them and collect them. I never did anything with it.
00:07:54:23 – 00:07:57:15
Ali Nassir
You used the T1 lines back in the day to do that. Yeah yeah.
00:07:57:15 – 00:08:14:09
Rod Khleif
Yeah yeah. And I did all that and and then, then I had them break down the entities. Right. You know, because the most of them are owned in entities and we’d get their home addresses. So I was going to mail them at their home addresses. Yes. Yeah. I had six just you know, I had six virtual assistants. Not in India and the Philippines.
00:08:14:11 – 00:08:32:20
Rod Khleif
Yes. Working for $12 an hour, $1.90 an hour each. Right. And they were happy to get it. I wasn’t like taking advantage of them. So I had six people working for under 12 bucks an hour. Wow. Back in the day. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, it was crazy. But anyway, I digress. So no, I love the asset class. So let’s talk about your your your portfolio and and you know where you’re at now.
00:08:32:20 – 00:08:34:06
Rod Khleif
Where are you geographically.
00:08:34:06 – 00:08:47:04
Ali Nassir
So currently we’re and we have been for a long time as a family office. We’ve always been in California okay. I have done deals out of state. I don’t have any current currently anything out of state. Okay. Although, you know, I’m not a post.
00:08:47:05 – 00:08:48:07
Rod Khleif
All your stuff’s in California.
00:08:48:07 – 00:08:48:25
Ali Nassir
In California.
00:08:48:26 – 00:09:11:13
Rod Khleif
Oh, fantastic. Well, that’s gone crazy. Although I just did a post like a few minutes ago. Okay. I just literally a few minutes ago. Yes. California. Is this legislature for an exit tax for for wealthy people? Yes. Okay, Washington has it, Connecticut has it. New York has it. There. They’re all grouping together to do an exit tax so you can’t leave the state.
00:09:11:14 – 00:09:31:13
Rod Khleif
So you may want to look at that as far as your net worth because there’s also a billionaire tax. They’re talking about doing a billionaire tax of 5% of the net worth of someone, not their liquidity, their net worth. So you could have a billionaire that’s worth $100 billion. That’s maybe only 100 million liquid. And he’s got a $5 billion tax.
00:09:31:15 – 00:09:33:17
Rod Khleif
Is that the stupidest fucking thing you’ve ever heard?
00:09:33:18 – 00:09:34:26
Ali Nassir
It’s fucking crazy. I mean.
00:09:34:27 – 00:09:52:21
Rod Khleif
It’s so stupid because if these guys leave, they’re taking, like. Like Howard Schultz leaving Washington. Not only did he leave moved to Florida, his whole organization is moving to Tennessee. Think about all that tax revenue and who’s going to pay it. The people that voted that stupid shit in is what? Who’s going to pay it?
00:09:52:21 – 00:09:57:24
Ali Nassir
I can’t tell you how many of my peers are already leaving. Yeah, and you already have big names leaving, like, you know, Elon.
00:09:57:28 – 00:10:19:21
Rod Khleif
Oh, yeah. Sure, sure. Google guy. I mean, they’re all they’re they’re not stupid if they’re going to tax net worth of a billionaire. I mean, listen, you’re talking about a billionaire that’s got and thousands of employees probably created hundreds of millionaires. And and they’re going to leave the state and probably take their businesses with them. You can’t make up this stupid shit like, come on.
00:10:19:22 – 00:10:28:11
Ali Nassir
Yeah. Your point is so valid. Like, you’re not always even though you may be a multi-millionaire or even a billion, you’re not always liquid to be able to. And so that is a serious.
00:10:28:11 – 00:10:45:11
Rod Khleif
And you can’t leave now because you’re going to pay an extra tax because, I mean, I’m sure you’re not a billionaire, but I’m sure you’re no question you’re a millionaire. And so, you know, that’s just crazy stuff. They’re they’re trying to legislate anyway. It is I kind of went off the deep end. I literally just literally just recorded a live for my team to post about that because it’s in today’s news.
00:10:45:11 – 00:10:46:18
Rod Khleif
And since Fox News today.
00:10:46:19 – 00:11:00:13
Ali Nassir
Yeah, you know, you’re not alone. Everybody I talk to thinks I’m nuts for investing in California, right? Every California unions typically that I know most are investing outside of state. And non Californians don’t want to come in. But you know rod.
00:11:00:15 – 00:11:05:09
Rod Khleif
Well I’m sure you’ve done really well there because the rents have gone through the roof. And you know, I mean.
00:11:05:12 – 00:11:06:19
Ali Nassir
Very which is good.
00:11:06:20 – 00:11:17:11
Rod Khleif
But you’ve got rent controls, you’ve got eviction issues in some of those areas where it takes forever to get somebody out. You know, it’s overtaxed, it’s overregulated.
00:11:17:14 – 00:11:19:04
Ali Nassir
There’s I can tell you there’s.
00:11:19:05 – 00:11:21:18
Rod Khleif
What’s your experience as a, as an actual California.
00:11:21:18 – 00:11:38:01
Ali Nassir
Well, you know, so even more than that now the cat’s out of the bag in the sense that and I’m just as a layman, I’m just going to, you know, put it like this, that now everybody kind of knows. Well, and I guess because of these other asset classes being so saturated, we’ve seen a frenzy to your point earlier where you see everybody’s getting in in this space.
00:11:38:07 – 00:11:54:08
Ali Nassir
Oh, sure. And, you know, including not just investors, not just funds, but the government, the lenders, the insurance carriers, everybody realizes, hey, wait a minute. You guys have been making too much money. We want a piece of that pie. We want more of that pie now. And so all the regulations are getting tougher results.
00:11:54:09 – 00:11:59:07
Rod Khleif
Well, I’m talking California specifically. Are you? You’re saying the regulations getting tougher nationwide?
00:11:59:09 – 00:12:07:07
Ali Nassir
No. Well, nationwide, but specifically in California. It’s more to your point, like the rent control, right? The issues, the insurance requirements because of earthquakes and fire hazard.
00:12:07:10 – 00:12:15:03
Rod Khleif
Oh my God. And these poor people lost their houses to fire. They’re still waiting to get permits. I mean, it takes forever to get a permit. And I mean, anyway, we could go down.
00:12:15:03 – 00:12:15:18
Ali Nassir
That rabbit.
00:12:15:18 – 00:12:39:24
Rod Khleif
Hole forever, but but, Yeah, no, I, I people know that, you know, I won’t invest in a blue state. Life’s too fricking short for that brain damage. When I’m here in Florida, it’s a red state. I’ve got assets in Tennessee, you know, Texas, Florida, Ohio, the Carolinas. And and, you know, I just it’s for me, it’s just a cost of doing business.
00:12:39:27 – 00:12:41:24
Rod Khleif
It’s just a brain damage thing, that’s all.
00:12:41:24 – 00:12:50:08
Ali Nassir
It’s not for everyone. But, you know, I guess for me, having a Rolodex going back to the 80s of bankers and accountants.
00:12:50:08 – 00:13:01:04
Rod Khleif
And by the way, you’re 20 year olds. That means a list of people with their phone numbers. We used to have this thing where where card. It wasn’t on your phone. It wasn’t in your computer. It was these cards called a Rolodex. Anyway.
00:13:01:06 – 00:13:10:25
Ali Nassir
You roll it next, so to speak, right? You know, it’s unique. I have a unique opportunity, right? Because I can source deals off market deals. Okay? Sure, sure.
00:13:10:27 – 00:13:14:08
Rod Khleif
You probably raise money for them if you need it, right? Do you, do you syndicate.
00:13:14:09 – 00:13:17:03
Ali Nassir
We just started that now. So so so that’s.
00:13:17:03 – 00:13:18:03
Rod Khleif
Probably why you’re here.
00:13:18:04 – 00:13:42:00
Ali Nassir
That’s right. I mean, you know, so my world as a family office that’s on autopilot and kind of stabilized and almost exiting really. And so but I’m not done. I’m at 56. I’m ready to keep going. And so there’s a lot of people who’ve come to me over the years that want to get in the game who are passive, don’t have the 45 years to go back and learn everything and reinvent the wheel so they’ll invest with us passively.
00:13:42:01 – 00:13:42:16
Ali Nassir
Advice three.
00:13:42:16 – 00:13:44:07
Rod Khleif
64. Sure, sure, sure.
00:13:44:10 – 00:13:51:16
Ali Nassir
May I borrow your torch again? It died out there. Thank you. Yes, please.
00:13:51:17 – 00:13:57:02
Rod Khleif
No, no, I just want to watch you. What? You like that thing again? Because it’s it’s a it’s a burning.
00:13:57:04 – 00:13:59:28
Ali Nassir
Although this is this is amazing.
00:14:00:00 – 00:14:15:27
Rod Khleif
Now we’re gonna smell this shit for the next two weeks and up in the studio, just so you know. But. Yes. Thank you. Roger. You did warn me. You did warn me. But I thought it’d be kind of cool, I appreciate that. Yeah. No worries, no worries. So are you going to continue just to invest in California?
00:14:15:27 – 00:14:18:27
Rod Khleif
Is that the plan or are you going to. You’re thinking elsewhere. What are your thoughts?
00:14:18:28 – 00:14:22:00
Ali Nassir
You know, people ask me all the time, what’s your by box and where’s your geographic.
00:14:22:01 – 00:14:23:15
Rod Khleif
Investor investment criteria.
00:14:23:16 – 00:14:44:16
Ali Nassir
Yeah. And I’ll tell you that my you know, I’m getting I’m getting more and more concerned about using the word by box or criteria box only because and I’ll answer your question. Right. But only because people start limiting themselves, I think within that box. And to me the first criteria is, is does the deal make sense? Do the numbers make sense?
00:14:44:17 – 00:14:49:03
Ali Nassir
Right. And yes, I would prefer to do it in California if I can, because I like the idea.
00:14:49:07 – 00:14:51:06
Rod Khleif
You’re familiar. I mean, it’s it’s your backyard.
00:14:51:12 – 00:14:58:10
Ali Nassir
It’s in my backyard. And I like the idea of the convenience of being able to drive to something. Yeah. Just especially with these days as the world’s getting crazy.
00:14:58:10 – 00:15:15:16
Rod Khleif
I’ll tell you something. The most successful operators I see in every asset class are geographically specific. They stick with in their backyard, and so they can go kick it and raise hell with their employees if they’re screwing up or whatever, they can go view it. And I’ve learned that the hard way, most successful ones, so I don’t disagree with that at all.
00:15:15:17 – 00:15:16:18
Rod Khleif
Now that said.
00:15:16:20 – 00:15:16:28
Ali Nassir
That.
00:15:16:28 – 00:15:39:09
Rod Khleif
Said, I disagree with your comment about a buy box and here’s why. Okay, because I believe to be an expert you need specificity. You need you need focus. And if you’re all not now, you may be an exception because of your level of experience. But you know, I teach okay, my students, I brag for a minute. My coaching students are their results eclipse everyone else combined, including big names you’d recognize.
00:15:39:10 – 00:15:55:09
Rod Khleif
But I teach them to focus because focus is power. Yes. And that that investment criteria by box helps them focus because there’s a lot of properties. Stick with one market, learn it really well. Focus on that one market. And that’s the only you know my my my.
00:15:55:11 – 00:16:09:16
Ali Nassir
I wouldn’t I don’t disagree with that at all. Especially for people who are kind of relatively new. You know, for me there are some exceptions and I guess I’m giving you my specific view. But but even then I have a by box, if you would. Sure. And I just wanted to make sure that people understand. The audience understands that.
00:16:09:20 – 00:16:09:24
Ali Nassir
Well.
00:16:09:24 – 00:16:10:20
Rod Khleif
You’re an opportunist.
00:16:10:22 – 00:16:19:21
Ali Nassir
Exactly. Yeah. We don’t want to be limited. And so the by box to answer your question is secondary markets 2 to 3 star parks 1 to 5. You know one being the the what’s.
00:16:19:21 – 00:16:21:02
Rod Khleif
Your minimum lot count.
00:16:21:03 – 00:16:26:05
Ali Nassir
Minimum lot count for me is 100. For anybody else getting in the game I would suggest at least 5050.
00:16:26:07 – 00:16:27:10
Rod Khleif
So you can have on site management.
00:16:27:12 – 00:16:27:29
Ali Nassir
Exactly.
00:16:28:02 – 00:16:37:24
Rod Khleif
You do not want to be going collecting rents from a mobile home park right. But yeah 100 is good. Okay. I mean, just out of curiosity, what’s your account now? Where are you at? As far as lots.
00:16:37:26 – 00:16:46:10
Ali Nassir
So I’m in the business still of buying and selling. Okay, I don’t hold. Okay. And you know, when people ask me that and you compare it, for example.
00:16:46:12 – 00:16:47:20
Rod Khleif
How many of you had. Let’s put it.
00:16:47:20 – 00:17:02:08
Ali Nassir
That way. I’ve touched at least 10,000. I would say close to 10,000 units. That’s a lot over the over the decades. Okay. Probably have somewhere between 2 and 3000 right now. Well, that’s a lot too. Yeah, 2500, let’s say how many parks? Seven parks.
00:17:02:08 – 00:17:02:24
Rod Khleif
Seven parks.
00:17:02:27 – 00:17:08:08
Ali Nassir
Yeah. Okay. So some of them are really large, you know, 200, 300 pads. And the point is that.
00:17:08:14 – 00:17:13:00
Rod Khleif
Are you all. Sorry, sorry to interrupt. Are you all lot rent?
00:17:13:03 – 00:17:13:16
Ali Nassir
Yes.
00:17:13:17 – 00:17:31:18
Rod Khleif
Okay. So, by the way, what I’m talking about here, guys, is, you know, a lot of mobile home communities own the homes and rent the homes out. And the best model is not to do that is to convert them to lot rent and have the person that’s in that home buy it as quickly as possible. For a lot of reasons one pride of ownership.
00:17:31:18 – 00:17:35:21
Rod Khleif
Two maintenance on these things will kill you. You’re with me on.
00:17:35:24 – 00:17:42:21
Ali Nassir
You’re. Absolutely. And you mentioned on your podcast before about how being vertically integrated is the ideal way to set this up. And that’s how we’re set up.
00:17:42:24 – 00:17:51:05
Rod Khleif
So so you’ve got a construction company, you’ve got, you know, you’ve got a property management company, all of that. So you that’s what you mean by vertically integrated.
00:17:51:07 – 00:17:55:08
Ali Nassir
I do mean that I don’t have exactly the construction component because I’ve never gotten exactly that.
00:17:55:08 – 00:17:57:06
Rod Khleif
But you’ve got a maintenance.
00:17:57:08 – 00:17:57:14
Ali Nassir
Yes.
00:17:57:14 – 00:17:58:12
Rod Khleif
We’ve got management company.
00:17:58:13 – 00:18:09:16
Ali Nassir
Absolutely. We’ve got, we’ve got we certainly have the asset management, the property management. But some of the things we’ve added, which I see others doing the same now and that’s great, is a dealer arm for example. We’ll buy the homes wholesale. Right. We won’t rent them.
00:18:09:17 – 00:18:09:25
Rod Khleif
Right.
00:18:09:26 – 00:18:11:11
Ali Nassir
You sell you sell them. Sell them.
00:18:11:11 – 00:18:19:15
Rod Khleif
Yeah. You carry the paper or you help them buy it. Whatever it takes. That’s it. And and you know, if you’ve got empty lots, you’re crazy not to do that.
00:18:19:20 – 00:18:33:22
Ali Nassir
Well, the whole the whole reason you’re buying a distressed community is because you’re probably if it’s 60% occupied, let’s say you’re probably buying it around 60% of value, right? Give or take. Okay. And so the way to get to.
00:18:33:24 – 00:18:35:10
Rod Khleif
You believe those deals still exist.
00:18:35:10 – 00:18:51:06
Ali Nassir
I do. You know, I knew you were going to ask that as saturated as the market is and it’s getting more and more difficult. Yeah. You know, you can’t especially like in California being such a large population, being such a large, having a large.
00:18:51:08 – 00:19:00:03
Rod Khleif
Cost of living where mobile home parks, you know, is a real, you know, benefit to, to a certain demographic in that state.
00:19:00:04 – 00:19:09:26
Ali Nassir
Right. And then like Florida, we have, we have something like over 5000 communities there. Right. And so, you know, we have a lot of communities and.
00:19:09:28 – 00:19:12:28
Ali Nassir
Death, divorce, those kind of things don’t happen. I mean, no.
00:19:13:00 – 00:19:31:06
Rod Khleif
Life gets in the way. You bet. And obviously the best deals are ones where people have held it forever. They’re tired. They’re ready to get out. Mom and pops is the expression you hear a lot now 100 space parks typically not going to be a mom and pop, but but but there’s a lot of competition. Like I said, my one of my best friends, Kevin Bumpus, my brother, worked for him.
00:19:31:06 – 00:19:50:23
Rod Khleif
He my brother owns several parks. He’s he’s retired now and sold him off. And but you know, I love the business. Don’t get me wrong, I love it. I it’s got legs. It’s got it’s it’s going to be there forever. You can’t build them anymore. Nobody wants a mobile home park in their backyard. So you’re not going to get it approved unless you’re out in the middle of nowhere.
00:19:50:29 – 00:20:08:22
Rod Khleif
And you know, and the other thing is, is with a mobile home, you know, it’s not like an apartment complex where someone can just move into another apartment complex if they own the home. Moving a home is not a cheap endeavor, right? So you’ve got a whole lot better stick than you do in an apartment.
00:20:08:23 – 00:20:19:27
Ali Nassir
Oh my gosh. Our our retention, frankly, is usually a lifetime in a tenant. Yeah, literally a lifetime. Yeah. Because who’s going to move $100,000 mobile home. Right. You know, when it costs you 25,000 or something to move it.
00:20:19:28 – 00:20:20:20
Rod Khleif
Oh, it’s that much?
00:20:20:21 – 00:20:21:08
Ali Nassir
Oh, yeah.
00:20:21:09 – 00:20:34:04
Rod Khleif
I mean, it used to be 5000 back when I five, 7000. Okay, well, see, there you go. And so they’re stuck and they have to stay. And then if they don’t pay, they get evicted. You you repossess that mobile home and you resell it.
00:20:34:05 – 00:20:42:03
Ali Nassir
Right. And it may be much lower in other states, like maybe, you know, 5 to $10,000 per section and most homes are double wides. I see, so.
00:20:42:04 – 00:20:42:29
Rod Khleif
It’s okay.
00:20:43:00 – 00:20:47:06
Ali Nassir
Even if it’s 5000 per section, you’re still at $10,000 roughly, including transportation.
00:20:47:07 – 00:21:05:19
Rod Khleif
And they can’t afford to. Yeah, that’s just not going to happen. So so no, I love the asset class. And you know, I like I said I was going to get into it then 2008 and nine happened. No, no that’s not. No. Never mind. I’m thinking about something else. No, I just decided to do multifamily instead. Yeah, but.
00:21:05:21 – 00:21:32:09
Ali Nassir
Well, if you’re looking at hedging your bet over more tenants. Yeah. If you’re looking at longer customer or tenant retention, if you’re if those are concerns for you, you know, the thing about manufactured housing, the politically correct term manufactured housing communities, the thing about our space, which I’ve seen since the Iran war back in late 70s, early 80s when mortgage rates, by the way, hit almost, what, 20% they.
00:21:32:09 – 00:21:40:20
Rod Khleif
Did in the late 70s, they were 18% 18. I was 18. In 1978, interest rates were 18%. Right. We were doing backflips when they hit seven.
00:21:40:21 – 00:21:55:21
Ali Nassir
Yes. And they they even got as high as 2021 at some point. They really like, I think 80 or 81. I was a kid two obviously, but but but I remember, you know, you could only get gas every other day of the, every other day because of the license plate, you know, with, with the and mortgage rates went through the roof.
00:21:55:24 – 00:22:10:17
Ali Nassir
And by the way, similar to, I think your story just I’m just getting into a tangent here. My father was originally growing up, you know, he was in single family homes, I think, like like you’ve done. Right? Oh, yeah. And we had about 120 homes in Orange County.
00:22:10:18 – 00:22:11:00
Rod Khleif
Nice.
00:22:11:01 – 00:22:18:16
Ali Nassir
In Southern California. Nice. And I think today in today’s dollars, that would be what, a million. I know don’t give me 500 homes in Denver. You know what I’m talking.
00:22:18:16 – 00:22:23:15
Rod Khleif
About dude, I would be netting if I sold my 500 houses in Denver. I would be netting a million a month.
00:22:23:16 – 00:22:24:20
Ali Nassir
I get it, I get it.
00:22:24:21 – 00:22:34:26
Rod Khleif
But I wouldn’t have met my ex-wife, who I love dearly. Still, my best friend. I wouldn’t have done many, many things. I built a beautiful mansion on the beach. I live in an amazing place now. None of that would have happened.
00:22:34:27 – 00:22:36:12
Ali Nassir
None of that would have happened. So there’s no regrets.
00:22:36:14 – 00:22:36:27
Rod Khleif
It’s all good.
00:22:37:02 – 00:22:59:07
Ali Nassir
It’s all good. But the point I was making is, you know, when when mortgage rates went that high, those houses came down like a deck of cards, like, like as if they were made out of deck of cards. And they all, everything just collapsed overnight. The bottom line and we I think he salvaged enough liquidity, maybe out of like 30 homes out of those 120 to buy a park.
00:22:59:12 – 00:23:01:11
Rod Khleif
So that’s what he did. And that’s what he saw. What happened?
00:23:01:14 – 00:23:04:08
Ali Nassir
Oh yeah. We actually before that move from New York to and this.
00:23:04:10 – 00:23:05:09
Rod Khleif
This was when when.
00:23:05:09 – 00:23:08:03
Ali Nassir
This is 1981 81. Wow.
00:23:08:04 – 00:23:09:07
Rod Khleif
So that’s when he bought his first.
00:23:09:07 – 00:23:12:03
Ali Nassir
Park July 9th, 1981. I love it, and.
00:23:12:06 – 00:23:14:20
Rod Khleif
I wish you’d have brought him. It would have been fun to have you both here.
00:23:14:22 – 00:23:23:18
Ali Nassir
You know, I wish I could get him around one of these days. He’s going to come back out. He’s been going through some challenges now. He’s 82 okay. But he’s he’s mentally sharp as a razor.
00:23:23:18 – 00:23:42:14
Rod Khleif
And that would have been a real treat. Well you know I yeah I you know I lost $50 million in 2008 and nine. And yeah you talk about a house of cards. I mean, I was only at a 30% loan to value, and I still crashed and burned. Wow. That’s how bad it was. And of course, California was horrible to California, Vegas, Florida.
00:23:42:15 – 00:23:43:25
Rod Khleif
I mean, they just crashed and burned.
00:23:44:01 – 00:23:44:20
Ali Nassir
Yeah, yeah.
00:23:44:21 – 00:23:50:11
Rod Khleif
But so so let’s have some fun here. What do you think AI is going to do?
00:23:50:14 – 00:23:56:03
Ali Nassir
You know, that’s interesting. AI is already helping our industry in some ways. Sure. Obviously on the back end.
00:23:56:10 – 00:24:02:24
Rod Khleif
But what about all these people that that are that are in school for legal, accounting, architecture or engineering?
00:24:02:27 – 00:24:07:11
Ali Nassir
It you know, you know, I, I’m from Silicon Valley.
00:24:07:12 – 00:24:26:29
Rod Khleif
Right, right, right. I mean, I just I just heard Oracle is laying off upwards of 30,000 people. I called my cousin who worked for Oracle. He left him three months ago to go teach, thank God. But 30,000 people. Amazon’s laid off I think 10,000 meta thousand tens. I mean yeah it’s there on the forefront of it.
00:24:27:01 – 00:24:29:07
Ali Nassir
And this is just a start right. That’s the point.
00:24:29:10 – 00:24:37:23
Rod Khleif
Yeah. These are the guys that are developing the AI. My daughter, my daughter does my SEO. I told her, baby, you got to find something else to do because open clause going to do it for us.
00:24:37:24 – 00:24:49:24
Ali Nassir
You know all of a sudden I have three teenagers. Right. Well actually. The oldest one just turned 2016, 18 and 20. And they haven’t looked at mobile home parks. And they don’t they don’t want to know anything about it from dad. Right. But all of a sudden.
00:24:49:25 – 00:24:50:06
Rod Khleif
Now they’re.
00:24:50:06 – 00:24:52:14
Ali Nassir
Interested in the trailer parks are starting to look a little prettier.
00:24:52:15 – 00:25:08:29
Rod Khleif
My, my daughter just bought my daughter just bought her first triplex in Tampa. Oh, my God, it’s a piece of shit. My maintenance guy’s been up there for three months, but she’s she’s. I think it’s about about ready for her. But no, finally she’s in it, so that’s good. Awesome. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But, you know, I hear you.
00:25:08:29 – 00:25:12:22
Rod Khleif
They don’t want to listen to you. You know, they want to hear from somebody else. And I teach this stuff so you.
00:25:12:22 – 00:25:22:01
Ali Nassir
Know, but with with the AI impact I think being in hard assets, being in commercial real estate and whatnot, obviously this is important. You know, as a, as.
00:25:22:03 – 00:25:38:13
Rod Khleif
A I think, you know, and I’ve been shouting this from the rooftops, if you have a job that could be threatened by a for God’s sakes, don’t wait for the freaking shoe to drop. Don’t dig your hole in the sand. Get into what I teach, get your ass to one of my boot camps, or learn how to buy businesses, or learn how to do AI or do something.
00:25:38:19 – 00:25:41:13
Rod Khleif
Don’t let the shoe drop because it’s coming. It is.
00:25:41:19 – 00:25:42:02
Ali Nassir
It’s here.
00:25:42:03 – 00:25:42:09
Rod Khleif
Yeah.
00:25:42:10 – 00:25:43:15
Ali Nassir
It’s here. Yeah.
00:25:43:16 – 00:26:03:00
Rod Khleif
My my my marketing manager, Matt, who was here earlier because we were shooting some stuff basically once he’s got this open clause set up, it’s going to do 95% of his work. It’s going to analyze what to run, what, what’s viral, what’s working. Do the ads do the do the posts, do all this stuff? I mean, he said 95% of his works going to.
00:26:03:01 – 00:26:08:04
Ali Nassir
Be gone. It’s crazy. Yeah, it’s crazy. But yeah, you know, I’m not afraid of it. I mean, we’ve been. Are you.
00:26:08:04 – 00:26:09:04
Rod Khleif
Implementing any of it yet?
00:26:09:08 – 00:26:16:08
Ali Nassir
We already are. I’m I’m learning still myself. Same. But my team is amazing. They they use it for almost everything.
00:26:16:09 – 00:26:16:23
Rod Khleif
Same.
00:26:16:24 – 00:26:35:09
Ali Nassir
Yeah. And so and I’m, you know, I used to be living in Silicon Valley. We were early adopters. Oh, right. For technology. And I’m not as quick as I as I used to be, but so I am learning and I think it’s we’re we’re not afraid of it. Right. You know, the point is to embrace the future because it’s here.
00:26:35:10 – 00:26:41:04
Ali Nassir
Right. And, and and we’ve seen technology revolutions. Excuse me before. Sure.
00:26:41:05 – 00:26:43:16
Rod Khleif
Technological revolution. This is the biggest one, though.
00:26:43:17 – 00:26:43:28
Ali Nassir
It is.
00:26:43:29 – 00:26:44:29
Rod Khleif
Absolutely this this one.
00:26:45:06 – 00:26:46:25
Ali Nassir
This is unprecedented.
00:26:46:25 – 00:27:12:12
Rod Khleif
Unprecedented. Yeah. No, there’s no telling you know you know Elon’s talking about universal income. But who wants that. You know I mean you know no that’s not going to be a lot of money. And and so you know I don’t and you know, he’s not always right about everything, smart guy. But but you know, it’s a, it’s a it’s an interesting I think we’re living in one of the most interesting times in history just to see what’s going to happen over the next ten years.
00:27:12:12 – 00:27:16:09
Rod Khleif
It’s going to be crazy, you know, robots everywhere, you know?
00:27:16:10 – 00:27:33:18
Ali Nassir
So let me switch to a tangent there because, you know, at the beginning of the year when everybody was wishing Happy New Year to people, as we should, I was I was walking around wishing everybody a happy Q2 second quarter. And people like were puzzled. And I wanted to explain, hey, you know, we really need to have a generational mindset.
00:27:33:19 – 00:27:56:00
Ali Nassir
Number one, and this is really 2026 is the beginning of of the second quarter of the century. And it also happens to Mark, I think we were you know, we’re talking about all these things together at a macro level. It also happens to mark the 80th year of our currency as a global currency reserve. It our 250th year as a nation.
00:27:56:00 – 00:28:04:09
Ali Nassir
And and not to sound pessimistic or negative, because I’m really grateful to be an American. And what? Oh. Me too. You know what?
00:28:04:13 – 00:28:06:01
Rod Khleif
And there’s some crazy shit.
00:28:06:01 – 00:28:24:22
Ali Nassir
Happening, crazy shit happening. And, you know, as a consumer and there’s a there’s a victim of consumerism because I’ve always wanted the gadgets and all that stuff. You know, as a consumer, I’m concerned that I’m going to pay 17 bucks for a latte instead of 3 or 5 or whatever, so that bother. But as an investor, as a commercial real estate investor, I’m actually excited.
00:28:24:24 – 00:28:25:15
Ali Nassir
Well, hell yeah.
00:28:25:16 – 00:28:42:03
Rod Khleif
Because debt stays the same. And if and if inflation causes rents to go up, there goes the value of our property exponentially. Right? For every dollar of increase in NOI net operating income, it’s upwards 17 to $20 in value. That’s right. So. Hello. It’s an inflation. It’s a beautiful thing for us.
00:28:42:04 – 00:28:43:25
Ali Nassir
It is. And of course.
00:28:43:25 – 00:28:46:06
Rod Khleif
I get hate when I say that online I know.
00:28:46:08 – 00:28:56:21
Ali Nassir
I know I hear but but it’s the reality is as an investor this is the opportunity. I heard you say it recently in one of your other episodes where, you know, this is the time where you start seeing more and more creative financing.
00:28:56:23 – 00:29:16:19
Rod Khleif
Oh, sure. Oh yeah. We’re seeing a lot of seller financing. We’re seeing sellers stay in deals. Right. You know, for a piece of the equity, you know, and yeah, there’s a lot of creativity happening right now which always happens when it when we’re in a situation like this I mean we’re seeing heavily discounted multifamily deals. You know, a lot of anything that was bought in 21 and 22 is is struggling.
00:29:16:22 – 00:29:30:11
Rod Khleif
Okay. And, you know, even foregoing dustbowl ray debt, even if they didn’t get adjustable rate debt expenses have gone through the roof. Hell I’m paying maintenance supervisor $40 an hour, right? You know, which is crazy.
00:29:30:14 – 00:29:31:07
Ali Nassir
If you can find them.
00:29:31:08 – 00:29:41:22
Rod Khleif
Yeah, if you can find them. Exactly. They’re hard to find. They’re going to be like gold. You know, we’re talking about how all the trades are going to make more money than the freaking white collar workers right now.
00:29:41:25 – 00:29:49:11
Ali Nassir
Isn’t isn’t it? Found the father of AI who was with Google for some time. I think he said something about, you know, if I had to advise my children today.
00:29:49:15 – 00:29:50:15
Rod Khleif
What a plumber.
00:29:50:17 – 00:29:50:28
Ali Nassir
Become a.
00:29:50:28 – 00:29:52:23
Rod Khleif
Plumber, right? Yeah.
00:29:52:23 – 00:29:53:00
Ali Nassir
Yeah.
00:29:53:03 – 00:29:53:28
Rod Khleif
Sure, sure.
00:29:54:04 – 00:29:54:18
Ali Nassir
Yes.
00:29:54:20 – 00:30:15:29
Rod Khleif
Yeah. But yeah, it’s crazy times to kind of be really interesting to be a fly on the wall for this, for this portion of history. But. Right, you know, again, if you’re one of these people that’s worried about it, worried about your job potentially, for God’s sakes, pick a side hustle and get going. It’s an incredible opportunity. I’ve got six senior housing facilities under contract right now.
00:30:15:29 – 00:30:30:21
Rod Khleif
Super excited. I mean, we bought them for we’re buying them for 40,000 a bed and you can’t. I literally got an email from somebody yesterday that said, hey, you want to get on this $150 million deal? It’s 300 and some beds. It was 358,000 a bed.
00:30:30:22 – 00:30:31:09
Ali Nassir
Oh my God.
00:30:31:10 – 00:30:36:09
Rod Khleif
Yeah. And I’m buying this for $40 a bed. So these six units. So I mean screaming very exciting.
00:30:36:10 – 00:30:38:07
Ali Nassir
But I’m curious are you going to be are.
00:30:38:07 – 00:30:49:00
Rod Khleif
You know, not the operator we’re partnered with. An operator is going to take care of grandma. I’m just doing the real estate. That’s what I love, the elderly. Don’t get me wrong, I love the elderly, but I’m. No, I can’t do it. I don’t have the patience for.
00:30:49:00 – 00:30:49:08
Ali Nassir
That’s what.
00:30:49:08 – 00:30:49:18
Rod Khleif
I figured.
00:30:49:24 – 00:30:50:25
Ali Nassir
Just leveraging the dirt.
00:30:50:26 – 00:31:06:15
Rod Khleif
That’s right. Right. That’s it. Yeah, but super exciting. And yeah, I love that asset class. Like mobile home parks. I love the senior housing asset class. Just because it’s I mean, there’s the baby boomers. You look at it, you look at a graph and it looks like a rat going through a snake. Sorry about the analogy, but that’s what it.
00:31:06:15 – 00:31:15:22
Ali Nassir
Looks like. Well, you know, I think that’s not talked about enough. Demographics. Right. You know how that really impacts the overall economy in a big way. And people just don’t mention it enough.
00:31:15:29 – 00:31:33:09
Rod Khleif
You know, it’s funny, I saw Harry dent and economists speak. Oh I love yeah, I saw him speak, I don’t know, 25 years ago. And and he, he predicted the 0809 crash and had I listened, had I listened, I wouldn’t have lost 50 million. Woulda coulda shoulda. But anyway.
00:31:33:12 – 00:31:35:02
Ali Nassir
He asked to clarify. Harry. Audience.
00:31:35:03 – 00:31:42:19
Rod Khleif
Yeah. Harry s dent. Yeah, he’s a sharp guy. I’ve had him on the podcast. He’s a sharp guy and I think he lives in Puerto Rico for the taxi fits.
00:31:42:20 – 00:31:42:27
Ali Nassir
Yeah.
00:31:42:28 – 00:31:47:23
Rod Khleif
That’s right. Yeah. Him and the other doom and gloom. Peter Schiff.
00:31:47:25 – 00:31:48:27
Ali Nassir
Peter Schiff is another one.
00:31:48:28 – 00:31:59:19
Rod Khleif
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But anyway, we’re having a lot of fun here. But no, I mean, mobile home parks are fantastic. I’m sorry. Manufactured housing. You are fantastic.
00:31:59:21 – 00:32:02:04
Ali Nassir
I use them interchangeably, too, because I’m trying to get used to it, but.
00:32:02:04 – 00:32:04:10
Rod Khleif
Yeah. Yeah, but,
00:32:04:12 – 00:32:25:29
Ali Nassir
But, you know, I mean, I think just to your point, I mean, as good as the residential, excuse me, the assisted living, it can be very lucrative. Yeah. And it is just the reason I’m so bullish on on mobile home parks. Another reason among many is, you know, I mean, if you’re talking about as the economy takes a hit.
00:32:26:01 – 00:32:27:21
Ali Nassir
Yeah. Takes a shit.
00:32:27:23 – 00:32:42:23
Rod Khleif
Yeah. I mean, I’m going to tell you something that’s going to infect multifamily, that’s going to affect my core business. Right. Because those people, you know, have to pay their rent right now. The only caveat with that is the government helped us during Covid. We got hundreds of thousands of dollars in rent relief. So I’m guessing they’ll step up again.
00:32:42:25 – 00:32:56:10
Rod Khleif
You know, shopping centers didn’t get help. Mobile, you know, office didn’t get help. But we got help and but but I know where you’re going with this. You’re going to say manufactured housing. I mean, that will always be in demand. Well, because it’s the lowest, lowest entry point, right?
00:32:56:11 – 00:33:09:25
Ali Nassir
Yes. I mean, you know, you already know this, but for the audience, for their sake, you know, you’re talking about affordable housing, right? So anytime the economy takes a shit and everybody comes down a notch in their lifestyle, right? We’re the last stop. If you want ownership.
00:33:09:27 – 00:33:30:22
Rod Khleif
You’ll always have occupancy. And see, that’s the that’s the same thought process I’m using for senior housing because these seniors have their, you know, they have nest eggs built up so they can afford. So they’re not going to get as hammered by, you know, by the economy. The only caveat would be if if they’re going to sell their house to pay for it, because then maybe the house prices will go down.
00:33:30:29 – 00:33:52:04
Rod Khleif
But but yeah, you know, I’m looking for recession resistant solutions. That’s it. That’s mobile home manufacturer communities. Definitely their senior housing I think is there you know, I think I think businesses that provide services are there. That’s why I was asking you about businesses because I’ve been thinking about buying businesses as well, you know, service related or other types of things, laundromats, whatever.
00:33:52:09 – 00:34:17:18
Ali Nassir
Sure. And I just wanted the audience to know that even though I’m second generation in the park business, it’s by choice. Like, I went and did these other things, and I and I did well in some of them. And some of them, I lost my ass, you know? But the point is that I learned through those experiences and actually being an appraiser of mobile home parks early in the day, I wanted to because I learned the street smarts at home from dad, but I wanted to actually understand the fundamentals of underwriting to make sure that I really understood the business.
00:34:17:19 – 00:34:20:22
Ali Nassir
So I became an appraiser. It wasn’t for the money, obviously. You know.
00:34:20:24 – 00:34:23:28
Rod Khleif
That’s not a fun thing. I mean, are you analytical? You consider yourself analytical?
00:34:24:00 – 00:34:43:29
Ali Nassir
Not anymore. So much. But I did want to understand the fundamentals early on. That’s very analytical. It is, it is. And I could do it back in the day, you know. But I think the point is that you really need to be able to understand the fundamentals, the underwriting on these deals. Right. So that was important because obviously you could make more money as a broker or as an agent.
00:34:44:02 – 00:34:44:06
Rod Khleif
Sure.
00:34:44:11 – 00:34:53:21
Ali Nassir
But I did that for that benefit. And the point is that the experience with the Main Street businesses and and valuations and whatnot only made me stronger in this space.
00:34:53:23 – 00:35:01:04
Rod Khleif
I don’t listen, I see it absolutely. I’m in agreement with you. It’s a great asset class. If you can find the deals. It’s a great asset class.
00:35:01:06 – 00:35:12:09
Ali Nassir
It’s getting harder and harder to find. And the point that you asked me earlier about how many units, I think the exception of. So I’m not limited to a community of 100 plus. Okay. I think the in essence for anybody.
00:35:12:10 – 00:35:14:04
Rod Khleif
In a couple of 50s, right?
00:35:14:04 – 00:35:24:29
Ali Nassir
Yeah. If you can buy a cluster 2 or 3, we get a deal in Stockton, California, where it was three communities that made up at least, you know, 50 to 100 units. There you go. This is back in the day. And so so I’ll do that. Yeah.
00:35:24:29 – 00:35:40:24
Rod Khleif
It’s the same thing with multifamily. You know, I’ll tell people, you know, if you’ve got a 20 unit or 30 unit and you’re looking you’ve got evaluate unit size and if that, if that, if that community adds to your ability in that market to have some economies of scale and maybe have one manager handle them both, it’s a no brainer, right?
00:35:40:25 – 00:35:41:02
Rod Khleif
Yeah.
00:35:41:09 – 00:35:46:14
Ali Nassir
So so that’s what we’re having to do more and more of now as you see the. Sure sure sure.
00:35:46:15 – 00:35:58:19
Rod Khleif
You got it’s like it’s like assemblage when you’re buying, when you’re buying pieces of land to put in a like a big corner, you buy you buy one lot at a time and you’re kind of assembling, right? I mean, it’s the same dynamic. Maybe, maybe that’s not a great example, but.
00:35:58:21 – 00:36:17:06
Ali Nassir
You know, it is. And at that end, the vertical integration that you talked about, you know, I think the fact that you have additional profit centers within that same community. Sure. Because we’re turning lemons into lemonade. Sure. You can profit on the home sale. You can profit on the note. So now those 300 pads are like 900 pads in terms of the rate of return, because you’ve got, you know, different profit centers.
00:36:17:08 – 00:36:21:19
Ali Nassir
And so that’s become more and more important as the saturation.
00:36:21:21 – 00:36:39:10
Rod Khleif
Is. It’s interesting you say that I was I was at a senior housing conference last week, and there was a guy there that talk about different profit centers. They’re like how you can have you could have a pharmacy component. You could have, you know, home like a home health care component. You can have like a physical therapy component as additional revenue.
00:36:39:10 – 00:36:43:11
Rod Khleif
So it’s always great when you can incorporate other revenues. That’s right.
00:36:43:13 – 00:36:43:23
Ali Nassir
That’s right.
00:36:43:24 – 00:37:02:00
Rod Khleif
So let’s shift gears for a minute and have some fun. We pre-fame this. We talked about this offline. What are some of the geopolitical concerns or factors that people don’t talk about or don’t think about when they’re evaluating different asset classes or different businesses or just life in general?
00:37:02:03 – 00:37:27:08
Ali Nassir
Oh, thanks for asking. Right. Actually, I’m glad you brought it back up because, you know, I think we all talk about well, not we all. Many of us talk about tariffs, for example, or sanctions or mortgage rates and things of that sort, which are all important and we should know. But I don’t know if people many of the investors, especially new to the game, are thinking about the underlying influence, the impact from global issues that directly.
00:37:27:11 – 00:37:27:20
Rod Khleif
Give me an.
00:37:27:20 – 00:37:46:13
Ali Nassir
Example that directly impact your pocket book and ability to borrow example, the Japanese yen and what’s happening with the yen. So all of a sudden now the bonds the Japan selling actually offer greater yields for the Japanese and for other investors, which was helping.
00:37:46:14 – 00:37:46:22
Rod Khleif
Then the.
00:37:46:23 – 00:37:57:24
Ali Nassir
US bonds, then the US bonds. And so that’s actually going to drive up our yields. And so that, you know, the fact that you could borrow at 0% in Japan, right.
00:37:57:27 – 00:37:58:15
Rod Khleif
And long.
00:37:58:16 – 00:38:05:00
Ali Nassir
Term for, for decades. Right. And then take that money and invest in U.S. Treasury bonds at a 5% profit.
00:38:05:05 – 00:38:05:24
Rod Khleif
Wow.
00:38:06:00 – 00:38:10:00
Ali Nassir
Which then was trickled down to the banks who loaned to commercial real estate assets.
00:38:10:01 – 00:38:11:07
Rod Khleif
Right, right.
00:38:11:08 – 00:38:20:04
Ali Nassir
Is going away because the bond yield in Japan is increasing. So that is an example. The petrodollar system.
00:38:20:07 – 00:38:45:16
Rod Khleif
What did you hear? Did you I don’t know if it was. It was just bullshit on TikTok because I my mind numbingly look through TikTok occasionally. And somebody posted that Iran was offering China and Russia free access if they decoupled from the from the dollar in their petrol. Yeah. Oh no, not free access. Offered them discounted oil or something I might.
00:38:45:17 – 00:38:47:14
Ali Nassir
Yeah. They get access to the Strait of Hormuz right.
00:38:47:16 – 00:38:50:11
Rod Khleif
But also they’re able to buy all if they decouple from.
00:38:50:11 – 00:39:09:12
Ali Nassir
The dollar and they buy it in the, in the Chinese yuan. Right, right. And so that is starting to happen. And it’s a small amount and absolute dollars today. I mean, I think it’s a few billion dollars that are being transacted outside of the dollar. So in relative terms that’s small. But the trajectory, the fact that it’s happening and the trajectory and I don’t sobering.
00:39:09:15 – 00:39:10:10
Rod Khleif
Know, it’s sobering.
00:39:10:11 – 00:39:27:26
Ali Nassir
Yeah. For sure. It’s not even a political conversation. I’m just talking about it as an investor and saying, okay, how does that impact the math? What do we need to do to prepare and how do we buy better? How do we prepare for that? And maybe it’s being more liquid. Maybe it’s coming up with other resources. Maybe it’s understanding creative financing, whatever.
00:39:28:00 – 00:39:29:22
Rod Khleif
How do you feel about precious metals?
00:39:29:26 – 00:39:30:29
Ali Nassir
You know.
00:39:31:01 – 00:39:37:08
Rod Khleif
Because I mean, mine have gone through the freaking roof. They have their in a vault downtown here and it’s been amazing.
00:39:37:08 – 00:39:54:15
Ali Nassir
So I’m not an expert by any means. But I’ll say this I understand why people are putting their money’s in precious metals as a commodity, as commodities, and it is an asset. Hard asset to me. It’s not a it’s not a it’s not a, an income generating asset.
00:39:54:16 – 00:40:07:11
Rod Khleif
No it’s not. And I like income generating assets as well. For me it’s my shit. Hit the fan fund. That’s right. That’s what it is. I bought it as a as a hedge. And I mean I bought it at 1500 an ounce and it’s been like 5500, which is just extraordinary.
00:40:07:12 – 00:40:16:07
Ali Nassir
I’m glad you’re sharing that with the audience because that’s exactly what it is. It’s a hedge. Yeah. Right. And it’s good to put an X amount, but it’s not it’s not a true investment in the sense that it’s not.
00:40:16:07 – 00:40:32:24
Rod Khleif
I don’t disagree with you. I don’t disagree with you at all. I like cash flowing assets. Right. That the reason I did it is I have a shiny penny syndrome. So, you know, I’ve built 29 businesses so far in my career. Yeah, yeah. Most of them were seminars. I call them failure. I don’t call my failures anything but seminars.
00:40:32:24 – 00:40:53:26
Rod Khleif
Most of them were seminars, but several worth a lot of money. But but, you know, I that’s to prevent me from taking my money and investing in something without fully thinking it through. So I put it in gold. It’s a pain in the ass to liquidate it. And so I that was kind of my way of, you know, I know myself and that’s, that’s kind of and it’s and it’s also been a, you know, an incredible run so far.
00:40:53:26 – 00:41:04:22
Rod Khleif
So yeah, it’s very exciting. But anyway. No, I don’t disagree with you at all. I’m all about cash flowing assets, businesses, real estate, you know, mobile home parks, multifamily senior housing, all these other cash flowing assets.
00:41:04:26 – 00:41:27:20
Ali Nassir
Well, you mentioned commodities. And it made me also think about rare earth minerals, which is becoming another issue that we have to be concerned about that directly impacts. Again, it’s all about the math. It’s not about politics for me. It’s about the math. So so if that impacts how much your cell phone costs or how much it costs us to get missiles or your cars or whatnot, everything trickles down to, you know, and I’m sorry, I’m jumping to another tangent.
00:41:27:22 – 00:41:34:20
Ali Nassir
We’re expecting, what, 500 million in commercial real estate bank defaults this year?
00:41:34:23 – 00:41:45:07
Rod Khleif
It’s a it’s a wall of a trillion. So who knows. But I mean my my SEC attorney spent about a month and a half told me he got six apartment foreclosure clients in one day.
00:41:45:13 – 00:41:51:03
Ali Nassir
See? So so this is and people say, well, it’s not my asset class or whatever, but it still impacts all of us.
00:41:51:04 – 00:41:54:10
Rod Khleif
Well, it impacts us, but it’s also incredible opportunity.
00:41:54:11 – 00:41:54:22
Ali Nassir
It is.
00:41:54:23 – 00:41:54:28
Rod Khleif
Yeah.
00:41:54:29 – 00:41:56:02
Ali Nassir
I mean that’s that’s the main.
00:41:56:03 – 00:42:05:07
Rod Khleif
Thing, you know. You know Warren Buffett’s famous quote, be fearful when others are greedy. It’s been a lot of greed these last few years. But the second part of that is being greedy when others are fearful. And there’s a lot of fear now.
00:42:05:08 – 00:42:13:15
Ali Nassir
I’m so glad you said that, because I think a lot of people, to your point, in Warren Buffett’s point, a lot of people are about to get sidelined. Yeah, the herd is going to move to the side.
00:42:13:17 – 00:42:14:12
Rod Khleif
That’s what always happens.
00:42:14:13 – 00:42:15:02
Ali Nassir
It’s what always.
00:42:15:02 – 00:42:15:24
Rod Khleif
Has a shame.
00:42:15:25 – 00:42:17:14
Ali Nassir
Right? But this is our time to strike.
00:42:17:15 – 00:42:25:09
Rod Khleif
This is this is the time to do it right now. It’s the best time. So if you’re thinking about it, get your ass to my boot camp, for God’s sakes. That’s it. No, that’s. That’s it.
00:42:25:10 – 00:42:25:29
Ali Nassir
That’s it.
00:42:26:01 – 00:42:33:05
Rod Khleif
Anyway, I appreciate you coming in here. Brother’s such a pleasure to meet you. It’s been a lot of fun having us this wide ranging conversation with you.
00:42:33:06 – 00:42:36:21
Ali Nassir
Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. And thanks for letting me have my cigar.
00:42:36:22 – 00:42:43:11
Rod Khleif
Oh. You bet. You bet. We’ll be smelling it here for a couple of months. Yep. Thanks. All right, buddy, thank you. Yes, that was good.
