Ep #257 – Omar Khan – Helping International Investors Discover Multifamily Opportunities
Here is some of what you will learn:
Why the United States is paradise for investors
The ins and outs of financial underwriting
How to vette real estate brokers
How to not be the chump in the room
Ways to set yourself apart with brokers
The power of referrals
Questions to ask potential property managers
The value of trusting your gut
How to build your team
The value of failures
How to mentally deal with mistakes
The best characteristics of a leader
To learn more about our guest, please visit:
Join us at a Multifamily Bootcamp, visit: MultifamilyBootcamp.com
Watch on YouTube!
Full Transcript Below:
Omar Khan– Helping International Investors Discover Multifamily Opportunities (Ep #257)
Rod: Welcome to another edition of “How to Build Lifetime Cash Flow through Real Estate Investing”. I’m Rod Khleif and I’m thrilled you’re here. Now you’re gonna get a lot of pleasure and knowledge from the gentleman we’re interviewing today. His name is Omar Khan and he’s been involved in over 3 billion dollars worth of capital financing and mergers and acquisitions transit actions and syndicated very large multifamily deals across the United States and actually raises money from international investors for deals here with and aligns with operators here locally. Omar, welcome to the show my friend!
Omar: Thank you Rod. It’s a great pleasure and a great honor to finally be on your show.
Rod: Oh that’s very kind of you to say that buddy. Thank you. So you know, I know you’re from Canada, talk about how you got into United States real estate and maybe give us a little more background. I did that intro way too fast and brushed over a lot of important points. So elaborate on who you are and where you come from.
Omar: So Rod, I moved to the U.S. three years ago from Canada. The reason was very simple, I was following a girl.
Rod: That’s very funny. I’ve just interviewed somebody from Australia and he used the exact same line about it all starts with a girl. Anyways, sorry please continue.
Omar: A lot of good stories start like that so you know, I moved out here my family’s always been involved with commercial real estate. Yes part of their portfolio not as their main business right. So we’re always new you know through my grandfather and father, a lot of the properties that we have I mean they’ve really helped us out doing the good and bad times right. So obviously this is an important part of my portfolio and so when I moved down here, I saw just the wealth of opportunity that’s available. I mean I’ve lived in a couple of countries and I can tell you U.S. is number one. There is no comparison.
Rod: No question.
Omar: And when people talk to me about all things are getting expensive, I was like, “Man, you have no idea how expensive things are.” This is paradise for an investor even in the bad times it’s paradise for an investor.
Omar: So we started placing our own money, we you know the usual thing happened one thing beats through the other. We open one door and three more doors open and we started partnering up with people with my finance background. I started doing a lot of the financial due diligence and I started partnering up it sponsors and now I run my own deals. So you know the usual evolution, you start and then you go from one to the next.
Rod: Right right right, and I know that you are involved in a deal in San Antonio with Reid Goossens who’s been on the show, a really nice guy. In fact he was one of the panelists at my LA event. Super super nice guy from Australia. He’s an Aussie.
Omar: He moved for a girl as well.
Rod: Oh that’s hilarious. So let’s talk about, I mean you’re an expert in the financial side of a deal. You’re an expert, I mean you’ve done mergers and acquisitions. Those are very high-level transactions and you know and raised capital for four deals in your finance background. Let’s talk about financially underwriting a deal. But first before we get into it, talk about some of the things that you’re seeing right now that are making the hair on the back your neck stand up.
Omar: Okay Rod, there’s, alright how long do we have? This would be a pretty long conversation.
Omar: So right off the top Rod number one, my thing is that, look when I move down here I talk about myself when I talk to people right. I say look what I move down here I knew the finance part right because that’s my profession essentially but I knew there’s lots of other components like Broker Relations, Asset Management, Property Management, all that kind of stuff but what I was talking to a lot of people what I very quickly realized is then a lot of people take a weekend course or an online course for like I don’t know two days you know and some guy who hasn’t even done like two deals to like put together two deals in his life is now suddenly their mentor and they took like whatever like $90-spreadsheet or $100-dollar spreadsheet and essentially what they’re trying to do is either replicate somebody’s 30 or 40 years experience like yourself. So as you’ve been through the ups and downs or through that spreadsheet they think suddenly a guy who gets paid a $152,000 in an investment bank suddenly they’ve replaced that guy and that’s not always a case. So the biggest thing that I see is that people take a lot of shortcuts and we both know that shortcuts lead to bad habits which lead to disastrous results. So that’s number one, on number two what the biggest thing I’ve seen is that people present you annual results, which I understand why they do because you gotta put it on a paper right?
Omar: What if you start asking them, “Hey can you show me your monthly results?” It’s like you just draw a blank. People start even give you much the results and in a value-add deal, a typical multi family value ideal 18 to 24 months, well the first 24 months or 18 months are the most critical part of that deal because once an asset stabilizes, I mean then it’s just a cash flow generating machine.
Omar: So if you’re not able to map all of those things out, well what are you gonna do?
Rod: Or if you, even if you do map them out you better make sure you’ve got enough money to handle a short.
Rod: You’ve got enough operating capital and there are a lot of people that are going into these deals thinking all they need to raise is the money to close and you know they’re not raising operating funds and they’re recipe for disaster. I mean we’re seeing you know in this hot market people are people are overpaying as well. I mean sometimes we’re astounded by what’s happening and you know at some point you know if the music stops, it’s gonna be a real problem. So talk about you know, I know you’re creating some software that you’re gonna offer to operators to evaluate deals and I know that’s on the horizon for you I’m sure it’s a very exciting project but let’s talk about how you vet operators right now? Well actually let’s back up. Let’s talk about vetting brokers first. So talk about what you do there.
Omar: So I’ll give you a recent example, a personal example and then I can relate it to some of my past experiences well personally. Now we did some analysis and we’re expanding into Jacksonville. So what do I did, first of all was that I had one of my analysts and myself what we do is we took a Google map and we mapped out all the good areas in Jacksonville. We can mapped-out all about not-so-nice areas and where all the recent sales have been in the past one and a half year that gives us an idea what some of the more institutional players are doing right. Then for instance when I do reach out to brokers, I can have a very specific type of conversation it’s not like, “Hey find me a nice cash flowing deal?” What does that mean? right hey I like to look at say a value at 120 unit property hundred twenty plus units vc property and say the Jacksonville Heights or in the Orange Park sub market off Jacksonville. So there does two things first of all that gives you credibility with the broker because a broker now knows what you’re talking about specifically. And then what it also does is, Rod there’s like a million apartment buildings out there like you’re not gonna underwrite all of them cuz they might not even fit your numbers right. So when you do talk, so when the broker now comes back to you and is, I mean you’ve thought about this a million times and I learned it from you. You know the brokers will give you the bad deals first right just to kind of explore.
Rod: Sure, sure they’ll test you just to say if you know if you’re brand new and have no clue what you’re doing.
Omar: Right so when the brokers for instance started sending me some of their deals I would underwrite them. I mean I would underwrite them right. I would then give very specific comments back to the broker saying, “Look, I don’t think the demographics can support it. I wanted some additional income with the median income here and the rents in here. I don’t think it’s going to happen.
Rod: Or I normalize the expense yes. And in the cash-on-cash on your pro forma is X but we you know and we don’t respectfully see that because we think that these line items should be more and we need a cash on cash of Y and that equates to a different price than what you’re asking.
Omar: Yeah. As soon as I set that Rod, you said great things, I learned from the great Rod Khleif right listening to you you know. As soon as we started doing that thing, all of our brokers would immediately be like, just give me an imager or they will like, give me a call. They’ll try to coax me you know I think this is a good asset and as soon as you reiterate your points and you walk them through the points and your line thinking, suddenly you’re not the chump in the room.
Rod: Right right right. Yeah it might even send them your spreadsheet say, “Hey, this is how we came up with what we came up with”
Omar: Oh yeah I mean I sat down with the broker I said, “Look man, I think you’re a really nice guy, here’s how I’m doing this, is you tell me what’s wrong in this or you tell me how I can improve myself” right which I think is a nicer way of saying, “Hey dude c’mon”
Rod: Right right right. Tell us how to make this work. We’d love to make it work if you can show us right okay okay. And so, and then when you get these deals from the brokers, talk about your relationship building process to have you know to build these relationships.
Omar: So that’s good, number one the best thing that I’ve found out is through referrals. So if I know one person and they refer another person right off their top, yeah I know effects of quality referral the person is a top performer and they also know that, hey this person means business number one. Number two, what it also helps is that when you give people like very precise sort of feedback on their results, then they take you seriously right. So because when they start taking you seriously, the deal might not happen in the next two months but it will happen.
Omar: It was now they know you’re not wasting people’s time.
Rod: You’re right. So guys, those are you listening, you know this is what we’re talking about here is how you start these relationships to build these lifelong relationships with brokers, to set you apart from all the people out there that you know really, that really don’t know what they’re doing and have brokers take you seriously because as you know brokers are the bell of the ball right now I mean it won’t always be the case but it is absolutely the case right now. And so you know we’re talking about ways to set yourself apart. So, then you know do you have any sort of a follow-up program to stay top of mind for these brokers. I mean do you put them in a CRM? What do you do to set it yourself apart?
Omar: So number one what I do is I get on their distribution list at least all the big brokers have distribution lists.
Omar: As this, for instance, as they send out deals, the ones at least they apply to us right because they’re sending out a lot of deals.
Omar: I get back to them. I say, “Hey tell me more about this or that” Again the feedback part.
Omar: And right now you said you know brokers have so many deals that you don’t even have to wait to touch base with them because they will be sending your deal and you gotta have to give them feedback.
Omar: But from the brokers phone of you Rod, I also understand these guys have to put food on the table. They get compensated when the deal gets done. So why should they take somebody’s, why should they waste their time with somebody who’s just retired kicker?
Omar: Right? cuz if you gotta put food on your table, and somebody’s wasting your time, that’s time you could have spent feeding your kids, paying for their college education, paying for your retirement, all that kind of stuff.
Rod: Right, so how do you set yourself apart in that regard? How do you position yourself so they take you seriously? Talk about that for a minute because I’d like to expand on that when you’re done. Constant feedback number one on their deals. Then for instance as an example, middle of next month, my partner from Miami, is actually going to tour not only the properties but me and the brokers. I’m gonna follow up a couple of weeks after that. And once a month at least one of us is going to actually physically be in the market having dinners potentially you know once your relationship develops a lot deeper with some people, you can go out for golf or you know.
Rod: Sure sure sure. So guys, I want to stop you and I want to add to that in a minute but guys, so you start the relationship over the phone then you must visit. You must break bread with them. They have to see you. They need to look you over. They need to see your passion, your integrity, and get to know you and that changes everything okay. So that’s the progression. And then regular visits, it is key you know. So can you buy out of state? Absolutely, but you’ve got to go there and visit and make these relationships and we’re gonna talk about some of the other groups of people that you should meet with as well but remember guys, think about how you set yourself apart. I mean I interviewed somebody or met someone I don’t remember how I heard about it but actually it’s connected with someone that gets sports memorabilia, signed footballs and baseballs and things like that he sends them to brokers. I mean these are kind of some unique ideas but you just, you want to let them see that you know what you’re talking about. That’s number one for sure but then beyond that it’s really developing that relationship and if there’s ways you can add value, adding value but without question the way to find all of these people is through referrals. This is not something you go try to find them you know on Google or anything you do it through referrals. Alright so let’s talk about property managers. What do you do there?
Omar: Again Rod, number one, referrals right. Good brokers look good property managers and if you talk to five good brokers at least in my experience, at least 80% of the property managers within a sub market they’ll tell you they’re all going to be, the good ones are all going to be the same three or five people yeah with one or two additions depending on everybody.
Rod: Sure sure.
Omar: Referrals are number one. Number two, what I asked when I am in touch with the property managers, I asked him specifically okay what is your reporting structure like? So how could you close the books? What kind of reports do you send out to me because I have to manage the asset on an ongoing basis? What are systems what systems we have in place? because I don’t want somebody you know sending me an export from QuickBooks. This should be a proper system at the back right. And then what are their policies for instance and again right a lot of this is you know you break bread with people.
Omar: How to figure out, but I ask simple questions like, “Okay, if you have a problem, how do you handle that?” And some people will tell me here a handle at this point but the really good ones I feel will just send me the documents say look we already have a policy.
Rod: Yes they’ve already got the procedures laid out, step by step, they know exactly what they’re doing in any good company will have those systems set up. They’ll have everything flow charted I mean they can like you said, just send you a document that lays out their procedure for every eventualities.
Omar: Of course.
Rod: For a fire, for a flood, for an eviction, for you know any sort of a criminal act. They’ve got a set of procedures that they follow to make sure that you know, and that’s that comes from you know working on a business instead of in a business and you’ll get these small property management companies that you know do it all themselves that don’t have these systems set up and that’s great. That hasn’t been said on the show before. You definitely add a value there.
Omar: You know Rod, the biggest thing, just to add to that, the biggest thing for instance for me again Rod is like a lot of times I realize my wife is a way better judge of somebody that I am. Actually I feel, a lot of times if I’m going for a dinner and you know I kind of take my wife and you know you kind of pick up on small cues like how does somebody treat the serving staff right or do they open the door for somebody or somebody you know are they moved to the valley or not you know I mean it’s not a science obviously but you know these are small little things they tell you about somebody.
Rod: I get you absolutely. I just I don’t know you’re just funny it’s like you took the words out of my mouth because I just spoke about this I don’t remember where but you know I have other businesses and I hire C-level people for those businesses and before I pull the trigger on someone even if they’ve met or checked off all the boxes, I have dinner and I bring my wife because I hate to say it guys but women do have better intuition than men and you must trust your gut. This applies to partnerships as well, a lot of partnerships in this business. And it is critical that you break bread, you understand what someone’s work ethic is you know what drives them, what motivates them, what their code of values are, and then you go out you go have dinner and you have a drink or two and you watch how they are and how they treat people and I’ve had you know 150 thousand dollar-a-year employees, a COO I was interviewing that I was ready to pull the trigger on, and I just noticed something about the way he treated the waitstaff and so I dug deeper and I found out that he had stolen at a previous position and I was ready to hire the guy and it’s just those little things are so critical for us. Trust your intuition. I’m really glad you brought that up. So um where are you looking for deals beside you’re looking in Jacksonville, you’re already in Texas and is there, talk about the deals that you’re looking for. Are you looking for C-assets, B-assets, obviously value out opportunities.
Omar: Yeah primarily B, C-assets that we can reposition number one. So but the big thing, you know Rod, none of this is rocket science you know.
Omar: Everybody I don’t even understand market rents are below say 10 to 15% of the low market you know it’s obviously in the path of progress or going to be in the path of progress. I mean we can see a fair future here.
Omar: And hopefully as much deferred maintenance as possible obviously no structural issues but like I joke with my partner it’s kind of like putting lipstick on a pig right. You kind of put in, you change the paint scheme and you kind of put in the right systems and processes in. But again Rod, at the end of the day a lot of this boils down to the fact that how good your local connections are, how adequately do you follow up to them, and then basically how thorough you are in your due diligence. So I mean there’s a lot of things that are combined but those are the types of asset but again
Rod: Let’s talk about due diligence for now. Let’s go there I know you’re more involved in the financial due diligence, you’re more involved in the financial due diligence than the you know probably the on-site
Omar: But I have partners who do the on-site and we hire the right people all that comes from.
Rod: You bring in, do you typically bring in the property management company and involve them right there in that process as well?
Omar: From the start actually yes. Right before the start right at least my understanding was that I treat them as a partner, so I say hey look then I obviously have you been here for 40 years, no amount of financial ability inside you is going to compensate for your 40 years of experience.
Omar: So let’s start a conversation. It’s kind of a similar conversation with the broker, how can we find a way to work together and add value to each other? you know and they can tell me, hey yeah that asset looks great but the past four owners, they’ve all got it and it just happens to be on that street corner where things just never work.
Omar: Right? They can give you a lot of local street level by street level knowledge that you just can’t get by looking at a Google Maps or financial due diligence.
Rod: That’s right. That’s right. Okay fantastic. So you know how many deals do you feel like you’re looking at these days to find one
Omar: God I think I’m looking at all deals that I found
Rod: Yeah but I mean like a hundred? two hundred? what are you . .
Omar: On an average Rod, I think even for the ones that kind of pass the smell test, I have to do at least like even 80-90 deals. Even moderately underwrite these deals. I’m not even talking like deep dive under.
Rod: Right right right right. So you know I’m sure that you do some mentoring because I can tell from your passion that you care about other people. So talk about what you know let’s say you you’ve got somebody in there in their early 20s that wants to get into this business, what advice would you give them Omar?
Omar: Rod I’ll give the advice that I’ve been very lucky to have really good teachers and mentors who’s always giving me independent advice and I’d give them the one advice that I, at least I get to give to a lot of finance people because I think we live here in the profession you can kind of relate with one another. A lot of people in finance and kind of those type-A personalities-I do everything myself and you know all that stuff. And the best advice I got and sometimes I struggle with it but I’m trying to get better is, pick one thing and become supremely good at it and it’s through the pole where you kind of have to have blinkers on. And trust me, I mean for me I still kind of grapple with it right I don’t know this.
Rod: You mean blinders where you don’t see outside of your narrow sphere. You know so funny I do a driving force episode every week you know talking about the psychology of success and so funny the one I’m working on right now that’s gonna go live within the next week or so, is about “Playing To Your Strengths” instead of instead of trying to enhance your weaknesses, play to your strengths because you will get further faster. So that’s very sound advice and top of mind for me because I’m working on that clip right now and you know so many people feel like they need to build up where they’re weak but I’m gonna say put a team together and align with someone that your weak and so talk about team for a minute. Talk about you know what you’ve put together and obviously playing to strengths and as an alignment anything else you would add to that dynamic?
Omar: So I’ll give you an example Rod. A lot of my network for instance is Canadian right. So while I still source a lot of my capital from Canada what I very quickly realized is that I need a team number one cuz I’ve got a play to my strengths so one of my partners he’s a capital razor out of Miami right One of the best things that as I’m doing this as we’re expanding into Jackson and this is just an example right as you’re expanding into Jacksonville because I live in Dallas and he lives slightly mirror, so a lot of those regular trips he can do right whereas I and but then we divide up the work where he it’s clear the marketing aspects and all that kind of stuff all the technical financial underwriting part I do.
Omar: And then we leverage off each other then within our deal, because my background is finance, legal, all of that kind work, I bring the very experienced operator in and my partner Reid actually is a structural engineer right. So literally that’s what he’s been trained to do. So when he comes in he can go through the bones of the building inside out and the reason being that what I thought was look first of all I’m not ever gonna be an engineer but even if I did read a few books or whatever I would never be at the guys level.
Omar: It’s just not gonna happen so why play a game where I’m never gonna win?
Rod: Right right or you know or struggle you know why struggle is the point here. And guys when you get into this you’re gonna wear multiple hats there’s just no question. You’re gonna wear a lot of hats but at some point you’re gonna wanna line with people that enhance where your weakest and that’s how you’re gonna get further faster. I’m just telling you right now so we even talked about this in my live events where you know and I forced people to network and some of them are uncomfortable. The introverted ones are uncomfortable but I make them get up and meet five people and exchange information and go have lunch with them and push them because this is a relationship business it’s a team sport would you agree Omar?
Omar: I hundred percent agree Rod and I can tell you this as a kind of family meal I guess. I think I do think everything should be done the computer but with life experiences and hard life experiences, I’ve realized the one thing my dad told me when I was graduating from college is like, look dude you can send out all the emails you like but you can have one coffee every one drink with somebody and that’s gonna completely change the game.
Rod: Yeah changes the whole relationship
Omar: And I thought that trust me I thought it.
Rod: Right sure sure sure you love spreadsheets man, you love numbers, but you’re a very you know you I think you’re an anomaly you’ve got a great personality you’re not you know some people just can’t you know that are very introverted even you know they just don’t even communicate that well but you’re definitely phenomenal. So let me ask you this, so far in your investing career talk about you know I talk about my big seminar in 2008 and getting my butt kicked talk about some setbacks you’ve had so many people think that success comes very very easily and quickly. They see people that are hugely successful and they see what’s on the surface but they don’t see underneath what it took to get there. Talk about when you may have stumbled or fallen and what happened and it may not even correlate directly to a multifamily deal. Maybe it was in your finance background but let’s give an example.
Omar: First of all I’d like to say Rod, I am very grateful that you’ll even talk about your failures because a lot of people at 99.9 percent of people I listen to they only talk about their successes and one of the things I’ve learned the hard way, that I learned is that I much prefer talking with people on how what their failures are and kind of understanding what they learn that I think failure teaches you more things in success fast.
Omar: Coz success is a momentum game right. You get high off on your own supply right.
Rod: Sure sure. I mean I let me let me I’m sorry to interrupt but you just triggered something for me it’s like you know back in 2006 my net worth went up seventeen million dollars while I slept okay and I didn’t do anything for that okay and of course I thought I was a real estate god. My head I couldn’t fit my head through the door and I will tell you that God or the universe or whatever it is you believe will smack you down almost every time and that was 2008 for me but anyway please continue I apologize.
Omar: No no no this is a great, look Rod this is a testament to your self-awareness that you can look at your failure and then analyze it. Lots of people go through their entire life and they can’t even write.
Omar: One of my biggest failures was Rod, I still remember this company, Seadrill. Okay Rod I worked in oil and gas. I did M&A transactions in oil and gas D&L I was following all the spot prices I was I actually did three billion dollars of transactions that year and I thought I mean wow I’m a freaking genius you know this is good I’m doing all this stuff and I took a very, and I also thought okay I’ve read all these books I’ve been investing for Lubar I’m a patient buy-and-hold investor right all that stuff people tell themselves but I bought Seadrill without doing a lot of due diligence and I spent a lot of money of that and I stuck stubbornly to my investment thesis throughout the entire although in turn. I thought I knew better than what the market.
Rod: You wrote it all the way down
Omar: Rod not only did I wrote it all the way down I oh man it was painful Rod I mean, I looked at myself and I was like I was so stubborn man, if you make a mistake accept it and move on but mentally it was so hard to accept it that.
Rod: Yeah and that’s very good advice and that’s very good general business advice because there have been times when I’ve been you know I’ve had 23-24 businesses some have been spectacular successes tens of millions of dollars and some have been most of them have been spectacular seminars and you know sometime you just have to look at it and say okay it’s time to cut my losses, suck it up, move on, and go for greener pasture. Painful as it is regardless of how much time, energy, blood, sweat, and tears you have involved in it. And sometimes the best thing is to move on. And I will tell you like Steve Jobs said, “The most intelligent people on the planet are the ones that can adapt to change”
Omar: Oh yes
Rod: They can move past change so yeah all right.
Omar: I’ve learned Rod. Let me tell you this. I learned the hard way
Rod: Yeah yeah yeah and it’s a painful lesson but you know it’s a lesson, it’s a good lesson you know that it happens and it doesn’t completely debilitate you. You survive, you come back from it you know as long as you’ve got a place to eat and a place to live and love in your life and nothing else matters anyway frankly. So let’s talk about leadership for a minute what do you, what’s the characteristics that you feel, what do you think is the best characteristic in a leader or influencer?
Omar: That’s a good question actually. Rod I think for me at least for a guy like me, I really respect, I’m a guy that I understand things are not always good or bad but things you have to be just right. There has to be a balance somewhere and I think for me the people that I do like are people who are transparent. So they don’t say hey I’m super successful. They’ll tell you look man it ain’t easy yeah I just didn’t get up in this Lamborghini. I had like there are levels and you don’t have to take the weekend course and see three YouTube videos and I don’t know you driving like, no it’s a lifetime. So what you’re seeing right now, is 30 years in the making I you know like that one of those guys said, somebody said, one company was going public and he said well now you’re overland billionaire. He said yeah I’m an Overland billionaire after 45 years work.
Rod: Exactly right that’s exactly right. Yeah, that’s great that’s great. So let me ask you this Omar what did you have to give up to be where you are right now? what have you given up in your life? what sacrifices have you had to make to get to the success that you’re at today?
Omar: Rod, my social life has practically gone down by 90%. I’m being honest with you. And this is coming from a guy who is very social like college like I had at least 30 people in my apartment every single day or about five days a week. Now my social life has gone down by 90%. I have friends who are taking vacations all over the world okay. They’re buying nice cars, they’re buying guys motorbikes, I mean they have a really good time and here I am, day in and day out, I’m just grinding. I’m grinding. And look, I’m not saying it’s
Rod: Oh you’re not complaining I asked the question and you know I remember being in a one-bedroom apartment when I had 500 doors and I could have done more but you know what I sucked it up because I knew that I could get further faster if I managed my manage my cash. Well guys if you want to reach Omar he’s at boardwalkwealth.com. Omar, I really appreciate you being on the show today buddy. It’s been a lot of fun and I hope we can stay in touch because I love your energy and say hi to my friend Reid for me.
Omar: I will thank you very much Rod. I really appreciate it.
Rod: Alright brother take care.
Omar: Thank you.
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